What happens when you mix financial strategy with a healthy dose of cultural commentary? You get Rich Girl Nation. This week on The Stacking Benjamins Show, Joe Saul-Sehy and OG are joined by Katie Gatti Tassin, the powerhouse behind Money with Katie and author of the new book Rich Girl Nation. Together, they unravel the sneaky ways consumerism shows up in our lives—from pricey trends to status-signaling spending—and how it messes with our wallets.
Katie dives into the “hot girl hamster wheel” of overspending, the wage gap, and why negotiating your salary (without flinching) is one of the best financial moves you can make. She also offers sharp, tactical advice on job-hopping for higher pay and automating your money to avoid lifestyle creep. Meanwhile, the crew throws in real-life stories, from Cybertruck depreciation to celebrating financial independence in more ways than one.
And of course, Doug drops in with a trivia twist that keeps things weird—because it wouldn’t be the basement without a little curveball.
🧠 What You’ll Learn:
- How to identify and eliminate unnecessary spending that doesn’t align with your values
- Strategies for negotiating salary like a pro (and when silence says more than words)
- How to avoid the early adopter tax on flashy new products
- The role of automation in building sustainable wealth
- Why understanding depreciation is a game-changer for big purchases
Whether you’re climbing the corporate ladder or just trying to spend smarter, this episode offers a refreshing mix of real talk and practical advice—served up with classic basement wit and a side of financial independence.
Let’s make money moves that actually feel good.
Deeper dives with curated links, topics, and discussions are in our newsletter, The 201, available at https://www.stackingbenjamins.com/201
Enjoy!
Our Mentor: Katie Gatti Tassin
Big thanks to Katie Gatti Tassin for joining us today. To learn more about Katie, visit Money with Katie. Grab yourself a copy of the book Rich Girl Nation: Taking Charge of Our Financial Futures
Our Headline
Doug’s Trivia
- Who were the people who were on the committee to draft the Declaration of Independence NOT named Adams, Franklin, or Jefferson?
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Join Us Friday!
Tune in on Friday when we discuss what we can glean about setting up our portfolio from the stock market crashes of the last 130 years.
Written by: Kevin Bailey
Miss our last show? Listen here: Trapped in the Spend Cycle? How to Break Free from Consumerism SB1693
Episode transcript
STACK 05-11 Katie Gatti -steve
bit: [00:00:00] So faced with the question, where did they go next with this podcast? The guys were recently joined by legendary musical genius, Bruce Dickerson, who’s agreed to be the new producer of the Stack and Benjamin Show. They were all excited to meet ’em. Hey fellas, I’m Bruce Dickerson. Yes, the Bruce Dickerson.
You have a dynamite sound. Fantastic sound. I have only one suggestion.
Cowbell
Doug: live from Joe’s mom’s basement. It’s the Stacking Benjamin Show.[00:01:00]
I’m Joe’s mom’s neighbor Dug, and you know it’s a great day when the Wednesday mentor is none other than the woman behind money with Katie, Katie Gatty. Tossin Plus in our headline, one Truck is depreciating more quickly than ever, which is it. How does depreciation work? We’ll share a case study of depreciation in action, and you already know it’s coming.
I’m gonna top this whole podcast with some absolutely riveting trivia, and now two guys who are here to help you put away the credit card and stash some money in a Roth IRA. It’s Joe and o Ju Jean.
Joe: Hey there, stackers. Happy Wednesday. We’re so happy you made it. Sit back and relax because we are about to man. Light it up with a woman behind [00:02:00] Money with Katie. Can’t wait for that mentor Wednesday. But first, let’s meet to these characters that are hanging out with me on this fine day. Mr. Og. How are you man?
OG: Happy to be here. Thanks for having me, dude.
Joe: Is it exciting now? First time caller,
OG: long time listener.
Joe: Is it, is it exciting having a high school graduate in the family?
OG: I mean. No. Sure.
Doug: No, no. He said this, he said this before. He said Congratulations on doing what you were largely expected to do. All along.
OG: I mean, we’re elbow deep in, uh, summer already, so that’s, uh, yeah.
Celebration’s over.
Joe: I heard you telling your middle son. Well, we were between recordings. Uh, congrats on being an upperclassmen.
OG: Yep. And he was like, whatever. Huh? We’ve got well angry. 16-year-old.
Joe: Is
Doug: that
Joe: wild
Doug: how that happens?
Joe: Just,
OG: yeah.
Doug: Life is serious, dad. I mean, kids don’t realize that ’cause they’re just on the train.
Right? They’re just in the flow. I’m just one more year of school. My god, this is never gonna end. What’s the big deal, dad? Of course I made it from 10th to 11th [00:03:00] grade. It’s like saying congratulations on, on finding your exit from rush hour traffic. Like, God, that was gonna happen eventually.
Joe: I made it. Well still congratulations.
Worthy to all the stackers that either are. Graduating or you’ve got, uh, kids graduating. Super exciting time of the year that we have, uh, just went through. Got to go to OGs, uh, son’s party, by the way, Doug. That was fun. Oh, you know what would’ve been really fun? Getting an invite, watching OG do keg stands at his kids’.
Uh, graduation party was pretty wild, and I never knew they could fill those things full of Woodford, but OG found a way to celebrate in the best way possible.
OG: No, Joe, you’ve got me all wrong. I quit drinking like, uh, Billy Bob Thornton from Landman Stick with Beer. You want something stronger?
bit: I quit drinking.
I’ll stick with beer. You know there’s alcohol in that, right? It’s a Michelob Ultra. There’s more alcohol in orange juice. I ain’t judging buddy. I mean, I’ve been on a wagon 80 years. I’m just saying [00:04:00] drinking beer, still drink. Well, I tell you what bud. You watched me drink six of these sons of s and I’ll come back in here tomorrow night and drink six whiskeys, and you tell me if you notice a difference.
I’ll take your word for it.
Joe: I gotta say, Doug. I noticed a difference.
Doug: You know, Andre, the giant holds the record for the most beers drunk in one, sitting in modern times. Really? Yep. In real life, you have 119 beers at a bar in Pittsburgh, six hours. You figure out
Joe: why that guy died young, right? Wow. Holy moly. Well, we’re not gonna do that today.
We’re gonna talk, we’re gonna talk money with, uh, that’s what
OG: you think
Joe: with Katie Gaty. Tass. And now Katie’s audience is largely women. Her new project is aimed at women. She finds a great way though to broaden that out for us. But a lot of this discussion is stuff that frankly, in a lot of the books that I see come out, a lot of the, the things that I read presented in old tropes that, uh, [00:05:00] really are not heavily researched, and I just have groaned just, just groan.
I see a new work and I go, oh man, no. Oh man, no. Katie shines a great light on things like the wage gap and about women and consumerism really diving into what we talked about on Monday. But today, she’s bringing that all home in a way that I think you’re gonna find very inspiring, like I did when I started diving into this work.
So, Katie Gaty Tesson, she’s our mentor. But before we get to Katie, we’ve got a couple sponsors who make sure this is free for all of our stackers. You’re gonna get some great audio and you don’t pay a dime for it. So we’re gonna hear from them and then. From Money with Katie to mom’s basement, Katie Gaty Tesson,
and I’m super happy she’s here. Katie’s back, how are you? I’m back.
Katie: I’m so good. Thank you for having me back.
Joe: Mom has missed you. We’ve missed [00:06:00] you. I’m super happy that you’re here, but you’ve got a lot of balls in the air right now. You are going crazy.
Katie: Tell me about it. Publishing and writing a book while also doing my normal workload for money with Katie and then like launching another show.
And yeah, it was maybe not the best time management skills, so now my, my work ethic is having to. Cash checks that a, a very ambitious version of me wrote about a year ago.
Joe: You’re like, what did I get into? What’s going on?
Katie: But it’s good. It’s all good. I’m thrilled to be here and you know, living the dream as they say.
Joe: Yeah. Well let’s dive into this topic and actually it’s funny, just from one creator to another, you know you’re succeeding when you get haters. Right? You know you’re succeeding. And I love you dedicated your book to a hater,
Katie: a 2018 troll. Yes. Katie holds a grudge. You know what I do? I do hold a grudge. I will never forget this person.
’cause it was my [00:07:00] first experience with experience, somebody anonymously online being, being rude to me. And it wasn’t even on money with katie.com, it was on my previous blog. I had had this blog just for fun. I used it to post life musings, to talk about relationships, to talk about travel and. Basically my whole world changed when I discovered personal finance, and I just felt so deeply in love with the topic and became pretty obsessed with it.
And so basically overnight all the topic. Subject matter on this blog transitioned to money. I think people were who, you know, the like 10 people that I knew from college that read it were like, why is she, what is going on? Like, why is she writing so much about money?
Joe: Why she saw some money like It’s Amway.
Come on.
Katie: Yeah. And there was some guy who was publishing under an anonymous commenter name that would just relentlessly badger me on these posts and basically told me to stop. I obviously didn’t take his advice, but as I was writing the dedication for the book, I was like, you know what? [00:08:00] You know who this book is for?
It’s for that guy seven years ago who was like, you should stop writing about money. You should really keep this to yourself.
Joe: When I opened it up and I saw that, I’m like, this, all thing’s gonna be badass. And it was. And it was. But that, that was great. Oh, thank you. Something I didn’t know about your history, and I always get so fired up about what inspires people.
Mm-hmm. And as you know Katie, from being in front of a group of people who rely on you, like you never know what you’re gonna write or what you’re gonna do, that’s going to inspire somebody. You got inspired going to a live event with some people. Mm-hmm. Got. This is horrible. But I remember this book too, like it was yesterday.
The one that you went to like, I Really Well, yeah. Uh, Lindsay came on the show. Oh my god. Uh, Manisha’s been on the show before. But anyway, you were at an event for a fantastic book.
Katie: What a small world. Yes. My work friend at the time, one of the only young women that I had ever really talked to about money, because we were kind of in a similar position.
I think we made like identical salaries. We had gotten credit cards at the same time, [00:09:00] so we were, it was kind of blind leading the blind to be honest, but she was like, you should come to this book event. It’s called Money Diaries. And for, I think it was 15 or $20, they give you a copy of the book, you get to go to this event and see these people speak and there’s also free wine.
And I was like, amazing. I’m there so. We go together. And it was one of those things where typically I’ve been to things like this before, you know, where I’m kind of like looking at the clock and I’m like, ah, when can I get outta here? I wanna go, go home. Well, and also Katie,
Joe: it’s a money event. Like, how exciting can this be?
Right? Totally. Like, come on. Especially, ‘
Katie: cause I knew nothing at this point about money besides the fact that I wanted to have a lot of it. So I didn’t think I was gonna enjoy myself very much. But boy was I wrong. I, I sat in that crowd and I listened to Lindsay and Manisha speak, and I just thought. Oh my God, this is fascinating and so powerful and I can’t deny the fact that I just have a very visceral attraction to this subject and I want to keep learning about it.
I don’t want this to be the [00:10:00] last thing that I attend or participate in, that’s personal finance for women. And so that really was, uh, a real turning point for me, which is exciting because I’m doing a book event on June 11th with Lindsay Stanbury now Whoa. At the 92nd Street Y in New York. So it is, it’s gonna be a very full circle moment for sure.
But yeah, I think it’s just really, really cool the way in which we can individually inspire other people with our work. And you just never know how your interest in something is going to change someone else’s life or their career trajectory. So be loud and proud about it.
Joe: Absolutely. Whenever anybody asks me, they’re like, oh, it seems like there’s a lot of podcasts.
I’m like, but nobody’s heard you. Nobody knows your story. And man, if you can open up about your story, you know, in Rich Girl Nation, you write that, you polled your audience, you surveyed your audience. The average income’s $180,000 media net worth, $311,000, that is kick ass. Yeah, it’s fantastic. But it [00:11:00] also leads to a question, which is frustrated me for a long time.
When I look at our stackers, it’s the same thing. It’s people who are on the right path doing well. There’s this whole audience, Katie, that you and I need to reach.
Katie: Mm.
Joe: And it’s so hard to reach those people. Like how do you get them to go to the Lindsay Stansberry event? You know, how do you get them to listen to money with Katie or to read your kick ass newsletter?
Like how do we get more people to actually pay attention?
Katie: Free wine Got me. So we could start there.
Joe: A podcast with free wine would be,
Katie: it’s a good question. Yeah. Because I think about the general population in a few different buckets. So for me, there is some portion of Americans in particular for whom all the good advice in the world that I have to offer them is probably not going to help them.
I’m thinking of low wage workers, bottom 25%. I can teach them about the 4% rule. It makes no difference because they need higher income, right? Yeah. They need higher [00:12:00] wages. They’re probably not gonna seek out this type of personal finance advice. They know it’s not applicable. Then you have the people that I think will listen and read and, you know, follow along now, and who by my wealth planner and, um, the, and the material really resonates with them.
You kind of listed out some of the. Characteristics, they are often earning a lot of money. They’re already on this path. They’ve seen it work already. So there’s like a belief in the power of compounding. And you know, the compound interest charts that I saw at 20 and was like, holy crap, I’m gonna be so wealthy if I start doing this right now.
But I think the toughest group to reach are those who are maybe in the like 60 percentile to like 80 group where they’re earning enough to invest. They might not realize they’re earning enough to invest. And so that gap, which I experienced personally when I was starting out, you don’t think that it applies to you.
You don’t think it’s applicable to you. That was something that [00:13:00] I. I’m very thankful for the financial independence Retire early community for is that really showed me that I did earn enough to invest even on $60,000 a year as a single person. I could invest. I just needed a plan. There are certainly people that I want to reach that I haven’t yet, and I think the way that I’ve found potentially to do that is by speaking to the things that are happening all around them, speaking to the challenges of the economy, speaking to the real world and making sense of it.
And, you know, it’s, it’s this sense of like helping people who might not think this information is for them, feel seen in some capacity. Like, I’m not glossing over these challenges. I’m not saying they don’t exist. You know, the, the critiques that they may have are legitimate and real, and so here’s what we can do about that effectively versus everything’s fine.
You know, what’s wrong with you? How have you figured this out yet?
Joe: Right. Well, you [00:14:00] clearly dive into some of these issues. I mean, a stat that you write in mixed households, the survey of consumer finances, mixed sex marriages found that 56% of husbands were designated as most knowledgeable about household finances.
So many of my friends are women writing specifically to women, Katie, and you write that with all the kickass women that we have leaving this charge, it ain’t getting better. That was in 1992. It was 53% of households reported this. Now it’s 56%. It’s actually the statistic’s getting worse. Yeah, yeah. It
Katie: has.
It is. It’s tough. And I think that there are, I, I see kind of gender role orthodoxy and ideas about women’s roles and what women should be doing or, or are sup quote unquote, supposed to be doing as very tied to these economic problems. You know, there was some research that came out, I think in February.
That showed that the number of [00:15:00] people who believe both women and men who believe that women should quote, return to their traditional roles in society has like,
Joe: how about that? How about that whole tread wife movement online? Yeah.
Katie: I mean it’s like doubled since 2022. So in a very short amount of time, we’ve seen this real resurgence in ideas about traditional femininity and masculinity.
And if you can believe it, Joe, managing money is a traditionally masculine, uh, endeavor in this sphere of influence. So what I really wanted to convey in that chapter where I write about that, which I believe is chapter three, knowledge Is power, is that this trend is most alarming when we see it in households where.
The, the woman is actually the primary financial provider where she is the main source of income and, and is still more likely to defer the long-term financial planning decisions to a male partner. Often citing something to the effect of, well, I don’t know enough to [00:16:00] participate equally, or, it doesn’t come naturally to me.
And something that I always want to drive home is, well, it’s not natural for anybody. Everybody has to learn how to do this. Nobody comes out of the womb understanding how to build a, you know, properly diversified portfolio. This is not something that, like if you a free efficien frontier baby, right? Yeah.
That like you’re gonna be, you know, just more naturally good at this. So I want to reassure and if there are, ’cause I, I speak to these women all the time that if that’s you, which I have a feeling is probably not your listeners, but if that is you and you’re reading this book, that you are assured that there really is nobody better.
Than you to make these types of decisions about your long-term financial future.
Joe: It was so sad when I would walk into, back when I was a financial planner, and I’d walk into meetings and generally it was the husband that would show up and, and he’s like, yeah, she doesn’t really care about this. I’m like, we’re not meeting.
And I was, excuse me. Good for you. Well, because [00:17:00] here’s what would happen, Katie, is that he would die traditionally, but in some cases she would die and she’s taking care of everything and he’s taking care of everything. And then, you know what? I didn’t care about the gender role. If I’m your advisor and you don’t know who the hell I am, and I’m the guy that knows more than you do about where your money is, it’s wrong.
It’s wrong. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And it is not gonna work. So it was so, so, so frustrating. You begin the journey, speaking of that, by looking at your expenses, which is obviously the place to look, and you start where you were told to start, which was housing, auto expenses, groceries, and food. What did you find when you started looking at your expenses when it came to the quote, big three areas?
Katie: Yeah. Well, you know, like you said, that is always the area that we tell people to start because traditionally those are the most expensive things that any household is paying for. And so I followed that advice and I was like, huh, that’s funny. My housing is under the 28% benchmark. [00:18:00] My car, I’m living within my means there.
I’m good. You know, I’m not driving a Lexus. I’m covered food spending. Again, pretty reasonable. But as I did that personal finance audit and I got everything down on paper, there was something that jumped out at me that I had never seen anyone talk about in all of the personal finance. Dogma that I was intravenously, you know, ingesting, and that was my beauty and personal care budget.
And I was like, huh, 10% of my income on beauty and personal, you know? That’s interesting. You know, Brad and Jonathan didn’t warn me about this one. Let me, let me actually go back and recalculate that. I don’t think that’s right. So I tally it all up again and it’s like, oh, no, no, it is 10%. So at the time. I was spending around $300 a month on beauty and personal care.
Now, granted, I lived in Dallas, Texas, which is very much a blonder and bigger the hair, the closer to God type of city. So I was pretty intense in my routines, we shall say. [00:19:00] So I, I tallied all up. I’m spending $300 a month. I start thinking about my take home pay, and I’m like, whoa. I think I’m, I’m like working for an entire month every year just to support all of these appointments.
And that was a real aha moment for me. So I, I spent some time really thinking about this and experimenting with how much I’m spending on hair and nails and eyelashes and tanning and waxing. And, I mean, God, you can spend three times that today with the way that cosmeceuticals have exploded filler Botox, you name it.
I learned that at the time, even around $300 a month was about average.
Joe: That’s just gonna say that you found out that your experience wasn’t abnormal.
Katie: Nope. It was very in line with the average. And so I sit down, I use this compounding returns calculator that I had recently learned how to use, and I find that, oh wow, if I do this for an entire 40 year working career, I am giving up a million dollars.
That is a million dollar opportunity cost. And that was enough for me to be like, all right, yeah, uh, that’s not a [00:20:00] trade off I’m willing to make. I need to really sit down and think about this. And so I call that process the hot girl hamster wheel, because as your women listeners may well know, a lot of these things are almost.
Coercive in nature. Once you get your hair colored, once you get your nail, you know, acrylics applied to your nails. These are things that if you do them once, you kind of have to keep doing them because if you stop, the grown out highlights look worse than no highlights at all. The grown out acrylics are gel manicure looks worse than nothing, so you kind of have to keep going.
Thus, the hamster wheel metaphor. And so I always write
Joe: the dark stripe down the middle. Yes. So you’re
Katie: familiar too. Yes. Oh, I get
Joe: it all the time. No, I’m kidding. But yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Katie: The point is there is an entire industry that is almost exclusively interested in marketing it’s products to women. And if you are a woman who is dedicated to financial independence, it’s worth taking a closer look at how and why and what you’re spending on these [00:21:00] things.
Because even beyond the financial ramifications, and this is I think the conversation, people are more comfortable having that beauty standards do. Psychologically and emotionally impact people negatively. So I’m basically just saying we should also be talking about how they financially impact you negatively.
Sure. The economic negative impacts are arguably just as damaging as the psychological ones.
Joe: Well, just the realization A, that there’s this million dollars that I know I look pretty everyone, but I don’t even worry about that the average woman does. Mm-hmm. An average million dollars in net worth over my career.
It’s funny, we, we just had a discussion a couple weeks ago with Bonnie Hammer, the, uh, the vice chairwoman for NBC Universal, and she was talking about how they would take the executives to one of their theme parks, one of those universal theme parks. And she got the idea for her book, the Lies Women Are Told at Work, Katie, on this rollercoaster, the Velociraptor, when none of the other women executives would get on it because they were going to be judged by the way they looked, and you [00:22:00] can’t have your hair blown out, your mascara running everything when you’re an executive of a company.
The rest of the rollercoaster was all. Dudes. Mm-hmm. Who, who, you know, just, Hey, let’s all get on the rollercoaster. Yeah. Something I’d never, never even thought about. But even so, just this idea that much like in Deadwood, you know, the old, the old West, like the people making money in Deadwood weren’t these gold miners?
They were the people mining the miners. Like women are actively mined Yes. By these quote self-care companies to get into your wallet.
Katie: For sure. And that is a really important piece of this that I try to convey is that I am not saying critically this, I think that a very common trope among women and money is they’re like, oh, women be shopping, women be spent.
And that’s not what I’m saying. I think that this is a really insidious industry and that women often participate and go along with it because they sense that there are very real ramifications for not adhering to these beauty norms. So it’s not as though. You just have a bunch of like frivolous spenders [00:23:00] out here doing it for fun.
I mean, we receive signals every time we leave our homes that the way that we look matters and there’s research about, you’re more likely to have mentors at work. You’re more likely to have positive outcomes in the legal system. You’re more likely to, you know, find a partner if you adhere closely to this beauty standard.
So the benefits are real, but I think the ROI is not good. I think that the, the ROI that you are going to get for the money and time you spend on this is actually going to pale in comparison to what you’re giving up in order to get it. Beauty is the form of capital that women are encouraged to shamelessly pursue the most.
And something that I always like to point out in hot girl hamster wheel conversations is that beauty is a depreciating asset. It will always require more money. If you are investing all your capital in beauty, you are guaranteeing a future of degradation, which as we know is not what happens to money.
As you get older and that money gets older, it gets bigger and better for [00:24:00] you. It’s a balance. It’s something that I think women need to be aware of and need to feel like they can and should opt out.
Joe: I was thinking even as I was reading, even for the 55% of our audience that are men. People that are broke, wear the brand.
People that are wealthy own the brand For women. I feel like this industry, based on what I read, is these people are getting money out of your wallet. Oh, owning the company is the thing. But I’m wondering how do you, how do you renegotiate that? Like how do you change that when the standards are so high, like standards that to your point, it, it isn’t like.
Women can just go, okay, I’m not gonna pay any attention. Totally. Yeah. And tomorrow, then everybody’s like, what happened to her?
Katie: You know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. So in chapter one, we do a hot girl detox. That’s what I call it. And this is the process that I followed. So I’ve sat down, I listed all the things that I was spending my time and money on.
I ranked them power ranked them. Most important to least important. My [00:25:00] highlights were the most important to me. The at the bottom of the list was like tanning and nails, and I just went one by one and I took away one thing at a time, canceled the appointment, stopped buying the product, or canceled the auto ship on whatever it was.
I said, I’m just gonna experiment with this. I’m gonna get curious. I’m not gonna hold myself to anything crazy, but I do want to see how it feels to revert back to my natural self and let’s see what happens. What I learned was that as I started taking things away, that, yes, the financial impact was definitely felt, but the bigger impact was the amount of time I was saving.
I had not realized how much time and energy I had been devoting to this. I think that curiosity and that experimentation is a really good place to start. There really is no hard and fast rule on this. I mean, now I’m at a point in my career and life where I could do all those things again and afford them and it wouldn’t disadvantage me financially.
But I don’t because I am now happier without them. Like I, yeah, because why Actually, I have found that a, [00:26:00] I enjoy not having to spend my time and energy on it, not just the money. B, my life really didn’t change. I think that a lot of people, once they start pairing back, realize that, okay, at the margins maybe, but really you will be surprised, I think, by how little that stuff actually matters.
But I acknowledge that it definitely can be scary, it can feel risky, and it can feel vulnerable. There were women that I interviewed for the book who talked about how much money they had saved once they decided to go through this process. And it was really, it was really powerful. I mean, there was one woman who basically said, yeah, I stopped dye my hair.
I just let my hair be gray. And I actually feel more confident now because of it, because I know that I am not contributing to a system that hurts women, that tells them that they have to look young to be valuable. And she said, I hope my son. Recognizes and takes on that lesson [00:27:00] too. And so I think that that’s it.
It’s deeper than money and when we can see these systems for what they are and see through the matrix. It can feel actually quite empowering to choose not to participate.
Joe: I love the value discussion. What piece of this do I value and which piece am I just running the hamster wheel? And by the way, I also love, and people haven’t seen the book yet, but the fact that it’s hot girl tm, the the TM every time just gets me well, so next you tackle earning more money.
Yeah. The thing I love about that is that when I was a financial planner, there were just times when it was an income problem, Katie totally. Where I’d look at my client and I’m like, you know what? We can pinch pennies. We can figure out what needs to go off the ship. But you know what, this is an earning thing.
And of course you then bring up the wage gap. Mm-hmm. And immediately, and please hear me through everybody before you cancel me on this. Okay. I immediately went, and I’m not talking to you Katie, I’m talking about our audience. I’m like, [00:28:00] oh God, I’m sick of talking about the wage gap and not that the wage gap doesn’t exist.
And not that there isn’t this double standard, there’s completely double standard. I’m like, what are Katie and I gonna do about this? But like a breath of fresh air. You tackle this from a much more scientific place and dive in much deeper than these bull talking points that I see over and over and over.
And by the way, you point these out in the book, which I was so happy to see. Like, okay, it’s deeper than this. It’s harder than this, so let’s go there. And then I went from. This is, oh God, to, oh, yeah, yeah. Let’s do this. Let’s start off with the good news. Things are looking up for young women right now. If you’re a young woman in America, things are looking, I mean, not as rosy as they could be, but it’s getting better.
Katie: It is getting better. The reason why I wanted to talk about the wage gap is because there is kind of a common misconception that what the wage gap data represents is that a woman [00:29:00] and a man doing the same job will be paid differently. And it’s not that that never happens, but that’s not really the source of the problem.
A lot of where this comes in is the way that women and men’s lives unfold as they start families and as they take on caregiving responsibilities. So the gender wage gap is largest for women who are like in their forties and fifties. It is true, right, that women spend less time doing paid work than men.
I think around 57 minutes, fewer per day, but they are spending about twice as much time doing unpaid labor in their homes. So that is going to contribute to an earnings differential. You’re going to end up with fewer resources just by the very nature of, you know, at the aggregate how people are spending their time.
I think Nobel Prize winning economist, Claudia Golden, has done some of the most interesting work on this and getting into the family dynamics that people are essentially looking at the incomes in the family and looking at the caregiving responsibilities and [00:30:00] trying to assess the best economic path, the most rational path for their family to follow.
And what she finds is that oftentimes, even if both people continue to work, one parent more often, the woman. We’ll downshift a little bit at work. We’ll take the less greedy job. Sometimes this is because she’s already being paid less and the man’s job is more demanding. Sometimes it is a matter of personal choice, but that that over time is what leads to this disparity.
And this is true even in cases when the men would prefer to be the primary caretaker or would prefer to be the caretaker that is home more often. That one of the interesting things that I found in the research that I did was that. Women are penalized when they negotiate for more money. Men are penalized when they negotiate for more time.
So if you are a man negotiating for more flexibility at work because you would like to spend more time with your family, you are likely to kind of face the same [00:31:00] pushback that a woman asking for more money might. So it really comes down to just behaving in gender incongruous ways, and I see that as really holding everybody back.
But obviously this is a book about money, so I’m gonna focus on the group that is earning less because of this dynamic. Sure. Women do not earn less as we’ve established because they’re bad negotiators. We know that that’s true, but women can earn more by negotiating in ways that more effectively navigate that gender bias.
Joe: This was, if we hold on for just a second, because I do want to get there, but I wanna stop on what you said because. I found this so compelling. Like, you know, I’ve always heard this thing that now has become eye roll to me, which is, you know, women just don’t wanna rock the boat so they don’t ask for money enough.
Not true. Correct. And when women go to negotiate, just the fact, and you said this very quickly, and I just wanna pause on this for everybody. Mm-hmm. Women are penalized when they negotiate. They’re less likely to get a raise, not by a ton, but by a little bit. Which is the interesting thing to me, Katie in your book was not that [00:32:00] a, it’s a high five.
When we first start working, everybody starts off as equal. And then for women it’s death by a thousand paper cuts, right? These little tiny paper cuts, these little, this little bit of friction here, a little bit of friction there. That creates the more men at the top of the ladder, more women at the bottom of the ladder, more likely to get a raise, less likely to get a raise, more likely to get the promotion, less likely to, to get the promotion.
This is not a thing that is a one, one, um. You know, I missed out on the one big negotiation.
Katie: Right, right. The narrative is much more complex, much more complex than it’s often made out to be. And I, I think that Claudia Golden has in her research kind of says it is there is gender bias, like for sure. And in those, in those negotiations, there are ways that you can navigate that.
But I don’t know, I think my perspective is that most people are doing their best and most people are trying to be fair. I, I don’t think it is some big conspiracy, but I, I think [00:33:00] that in general, like part of the issue for everybody, not just women, though, women stand more to gain from this is degraded labor power.
Like women and men are going to have a harder time negotiating if they’re individuals going up against a corporation than part of say, a union. And we know that like all unionized workers earn more than non-unionized workers, but women, especially women in unions. Earn more. So I think like the, the wage gap will say is, is smaller within unions.
So I think that even then, one of the takeaways that if we, if we widen the aperture for this conversation and look at all the different factors that are going to depress wages for everybody, and particularly women, we get to have. I think more interesting conversations about real world tactics that can help people improve this in their own lives.
And I don’t think that we get there if we kind of stay on the surface with the 83 cents on the dollar.
Joe: A hundred percent. And that’s why I found this such a [00:34:00] breath of fresh air is that to your point, and you said this earlier, there’s these cultural norms and these biases, and we need to be aware of them.
I mean, we, we, and then once we’re aware of them, then we can focus on fixing it. You can’t fix it. Mm-hmm. Unless you know how it’s broken.
Katie: You have to understand it. You have to understand where, where it’s coming from to
Joe: the fact that if a man goes and asks for more time to be at home, he’s more likely to be told no is really the counter.
I mean, it’s the exact point that you’re talking about with, with wages. So you get tactical here that there’s some ways that women can fight this and a big one is. You’re more likely to score more money by looking at maybe a different firm that you don’t work at yet?
Katie: Yeah, I mean, there are a couple things at the general level.
The one piece of advice that I think every woman should know that I think about every time I go into a negotiation now is stop talking. And I know that that sounds really brash, but hear me out. Women are socialized. [00:35:00] Sometimes subconsciously to put other people at ease and to make people feel comfortable, to be accommodating, that’s can be a nice trait.
But when you’re asking for more money, that is an inherently uncomfortable and somewhat adversarial conversation. And so often what they see is that women will make the ask, but then be more likely to kind of then like immediately begin negotiating against themselves to like make the conversation a little more comfortable.
Well,
Joe: you know, if you can’t do that much, maybe just a, and I understand that this might be a bad time. Yeah. Or I totally understand
Katie: if you can’t do this because I know the economy’s bad, whatever. Yeah. The best advice I’ve ever gotten was. Allow the uncomfortable silence, make the ask, say, what do you think?
And then stop talking. That that is a really powerful small change that no matter what the negotiation is for what you’re asking for, that, that is like a little rhetorical tweak that’s worth making. But yes, I think the, the bigger picture thing and the more specific, when you are trying to earn [00:36:00] more money, you are probably going to be offered more if you switch firms.
We, we know that this is true now, but that negotiating in a company or with a hiring manager where you don’t have any track record, you don’t have anything to point to, to say like, oh, this is why you should pay me more than you’re offering me. That can be challenging because you don’t really have anything to point to.
So yes, in chapter two there are a lot of, uh, kind of a step by step of how to think about negotiating in that sort of situation when you are trying to negotiate outside of your existing company.
Joe: Man, and just shut up, is this,
Katie: it’s so simple, but yeah, every single time, I, I mean, it still is something that I have to really, you’re, I mean, I’m biting my tongue.
Like I so badly want to be like, but I totally get it. And it’s fine if you can’t. It just, it’s just tough. It’s tough. I must
Joe: be a woman at heart too, ’cause I do the same thing. I’m like, [00:37:00] well, you know, if it’s gonna be. Yeah. Um, one other thing tactically factors throughout the book, and that’s this idea of automation.
You know, and I don’t know if you actually state how big automation is, but it seems like setting up systems, Katie, really, really, really important for our average stacker out there.
Katie: Yeah, definitely. The chapter that I spend the most time getting into the strategy and laying out a very specific roadmap is chapter six.
It’s called Don’t Outlive Your Assets. It rests on the assumption that you are contributing in a, I say just like a dollar cost averaging way, right? That you’re, you’re making the decision one time, you are identifying the amount. Hopefully you’re maxing out a a 401k and an IRA and contributing something to a brokerage account too, if you can swing it.
That is how the strategy really comes together and how you benefit from the flexibility on the drawdown that I outline in great detail. But I think that the automation piece is. [00:38:00] Really critical for people who earn a regular income. If you know how much money is gonna be coming in every month, there’s almost no reason not to do this.
This was a critical, critical piece, particularly in the beginning of my financial journey where I had a system set up where I got paid on the fifth and the 20th, and I decided, okay, this is how much is gonna go into this account. This is how much is gonna go into this account. And the auto transfers happened on the sixth, the seventh and the eighth, and then the 21st, the 22nd and the 23rd.
And it was like, whoosh. The money was gone before I had a chance to do anything with it. And so I had this friend who. I think saw the progress I was making or was aware that I was really into this stuff, probably ’cause of the blog. She was like, Hey, I just, I don’t, I don’t know what I’m doing. Can you look, is this the
Joe: Peloton instructor?
Katie: Yeah, yeah,
Joe: yeah, yeah, yeah.
Katie: She’s like, um, it’s so cool. It was such a wild moment. So she, you know, whips out her Bank of America account and I’m kind wide-eyed looking at those credits to the checking account. I was like, damn, [00:39:00] because at the time I made $60,000 a year. She made $80,000 a year. So I’m like, I know she can invest, right?
Like we have very similar lifestyles. I’m investing a lot. She can definitely invest and I’m just kind of blown away at how much money she has coming in. So I get her permission, right? We’re sitting there with her laptop and I’m like, I’m gonna set up some automatic contributions for you. Let me open a Roth IRA, and a brokerage account for you.
With Betterment, you don’t have to do anything. You don’t have to know anything. You just have to not turn these off. Right? That’s all you have to do. We set them up and I don’t talk to her about it again. I mean, that was it. Like we really didn’t talk about it again one time
Joe: pay, I’m done
Katie: one time, done 18 months pass, because this was in 2019, so now we’re like, well into the pandemic.
She’s a fitness instructor, so that’s not going super hot in 2020 and the PPP loan is run out. Right. So she’s like, I gotta get money from somewhere. Mm-hmm. She texts me one day that August and she’s like. Oh my God, I have $30,000 in that account. She couldn’t believe it. I mean, I couldn’t believe it. We were both stunned.
So I think the [00:40:00] power of automation, of taking the willpower out of it, taking the discipline out of it, making the good decision once and then letting it run. I have seen that firsthand in my life and in others’ lives. Just absolutely transform their financial situation.
Joe: Zero to $30,000.
Katie: Crazy. 18 months. I mean, just wild, wild.
So,
Joe: so exciting. And you can do it two stackers. And you know what, Katie has a new book that came out yesterday to help you. It is Rich Girl Nation and available everywhere yesterday. Katie, thanks so much for mentoring our stacker family today. I super appreciate everything you do.
Katie: Well, I’m so glad to be here.
Thank you so much for having me, Joe. It was a pleasure as always. And uh, yeah, read Rich Girl Nation and for the 55% of your listeners who are, uh, rich boys, give it to your wives and girlfriends. Or your daughters.
Joe: Perfect gift.
Doug: Hey there, stackers. I’m Joe’s mom’s neighbor, Doug, and as we draw closer to Independence Day, I remember [00:41:00] my first day of independence. I was 18 years old and ready to rumble. Sadly, the El Camino ran outta gas as I rumbled down the road, and I had to walk back and ask Joe’s mom for gas money. But then, but then I was a independent baby until I, uh, until I realized I didn’t have any money for food.
So I went back to Joe’s house and asked Joe’s mom for an egg salad sandwich, which, you know, when you think about it, it’s also a chicken salad sandwich. Then she think about it. Then she helped me place an ad in the paper, and I, I, Joe just got it. I just got it. And I’m wondering which sandwich came first.
And then Joe’s mom, she helped me place an ad in the paper, and I ended up in a rewarding job working with juvenile delinquents. I just stood on the corner and told ’em when the cops were coming, oh, they paid me handsomely. Anywho enough about me. I was just thinking that way. Back on today’s date in 1776, the Continental Congress created a committee to draft the Declaration of Independence.[00:42:00]
Here’s maybe the hardest question we’ve done that doesn’t happen on a Friday. Name someone on that committee. Not named Jefferson Adams or Franklin. I’ll be back right after I go Fold. Joe’s Mom’s Laundry. It’s Laundry day.
Hey there, stackers. I’m laundry sheet lover and guy who can fold with the best of them. Joe’s mom’s neighbor, Doug. Actually, I can’t. I can fold the crap outta stuff. I’m good. Laundry day. It’s the only day you can say I love the smell of this day. Fresh, clean clothing and everything, all neat and tidy.
Let’s tidy up today’s trivia while we’re at it on today’s date. Way back in 1776, the Continental Congress created a committee to draft the Declaration of Independence. Name anyone, I mean anyone on that committee, not named Adams, Franklin or Jefferson. You can’t do it, can you? It’s impossible. The answer.
There were [00:43:00] two. Roger Sherman. And Robert R. Livingston also served on the committee, which I’ve heard from A reliable source didn’t have a single PowerPoint presentation and whipped up a completed document in only 17 days. Without chat. GPT. How the hell did they do that? Kids there once was a time when people wrote for themselves, I know they were total ninjas.
It’s like a superpower. And now to today’s headline with Joe and og.
Joe: That is amazing. No PowerPoint and the fact that I, yeah. Yeah. Not that there were two people on that committee that, uh, largely have been forgotten, Doug, but second, no PowerPoint. Like, how do you get through that?
Doug: Well, I don’t know how anybody was able to synthesize an idea without a PowerPoint created by like a junior analyst that they’re getting billed for like $280 an hour.
Joe: Big thanks to Katie for, for joining us and the, uh, hot girl hamster wheel [00:44:00] and women taking money from women in the name of, that’s the best visual that I’ve had and gotten from this show in months. Doug, you deserve the, you know, the highlights, the tr you need highlights in that hair.
Doug: Oh, I’ve got highlights.
They’re the wrong color, but I’ve got highlights already. I got more highlights. Doug Damon College
OG: was hot girl hamster wheel.
Joe: It was the, the question we always ask Doug got that right. The question we always ask Doug, is whether the carpeting matches the drapes. There’s no carpeting and I just threw up in my mouth.
Have you heard of Manscaping? No. And we’re done. It’s all hardwood floors. Let’s go. Let’s go into to our headline.
headlines: Hello darlings.. And now it’s time for your favorite part of the show, our Stacking Benjamin’s headlines.
Joe: Well, we’re seeing depreciation in action, gentlemen. Og, this idea of depreciating assets.
Take us through a little one-on-one for maybe our younger stackers. How does depreciation work?
OG: Well, what are you [00:45:00] talking about? Like in what context?
Joe: Yeah, just when you depreciate an asset, you know,
OG: you’re talking about like on your taxes.
Joe: Yeah. Yeah. How does that work?
OG: Well, you’re talking about a business owner who has acquired a, something related to their business that has to, uh, be spent over time.
I mean. If you’re a business owner and you have an ex, you have to buy something or you have an expense in your business, it has to go in one, two categories. It’s either something that’s consumed immediately, or it’s something that by the IRS standards is consumed over long periods of time. So like if you, I mean, nobody does this anymore, but if you bought a photocopy machine or a computer, a desk, or a piece of equipment, like that’s usable over a long period of time, if you buy a ream of paper that’s consumable, you’re gonna use that right away.
And so the ream of paper is an expense. The expense associated with buying the printer or the expense associated with buying the machinery is consumable over long periods of time. So the IRS has a schedule that says, Hey, this piece of equipment was [00:46:00] 500,000. You get to write a hundred thousand of it off every year for five years, or you write it off over 27 years or over 15, or whatever the schedule says.
Every type of property’s a little different. On occasion, there’s um, programs that allow you to accelerate that depreciation. So you can do two years at one time, three years at one time, all the years at one time. But the downside is, is that when you sell it, sell the property in the future, you pay income taxes on the difference
Joe: on all of it.
So instead of waiting for later to take all that income tax goodness, you’re able to get it a little bit at a time throughout the life of the product.
OG: Yeah, you can. Which could also be bad, depending. Yep,
Joe: sure. Yeah, no, I can see how it’s a great thing today, but then in the far future, you know, I mean, at some point you gotta pay the piper, right?
You’re just like, okay. It’s funny. When we talk about depreciation, the reason I wanna bring that up is that there truly are two different things that we talk about. We use the same word, business owners use it, and depreciation can be great on your taxes, but also things lose value over time, and so it becomes [00:47:00] worthless over time.
And so you’ve got depreciation that might be good today for some people. And depreciation that’s maybe not so good if you’re on the consumer side and your asset depreciates. It just isn’t worth what it used to be worth.
OG: Yeah. Yeah. Like a car or something,
Joe: you know? And the people that see depreciation the most are early adopters, I think, because early adopters off in OG have to pay a premium for that thing.
So that means, you know, they’re not making a ton of them. It’s not proven yet. So then we, we pay a big high fee for that. And then if the product doesn’t take off the way that we thought, then we end up with depreciation to at tire. And that’s, that’s the case here. Uh, this is, uh, from the website, electric.co, that looks at a lot of different electric vehicles.
Tesla just started accepting cyber truck trade-ins and, uh, man, oh gee, the depreciation for the early on the cyber. Not looking good for the cyber truck owners. 40,000 people converted their reservations into [00:48:00] orders. There was a million reservations originally. People paid a hundred thousand dollars for their cyber truck and Tesla’s offering $65,400 for it, a 34.6% depreciation.
Now, I don’t really want to talk about Tesla, but I do want to talk about just early adopters in anything og. This is kind of the cost of early adoption of any product is that you could get hammered on the depreciation side for a variety of reasons, but early adoption comes sometimes I think with a big price tag like we’re seeing here with a cyber truck.
OG: Yeah, this is true for technology. It’s true for consumer goods. It’s not surprising for cars, obviously, you know? Sure. The, the old adage of, you know, the car loses 20% of its value when you drive it off the lot, you know, right away. So, um. I think people aren’t surprised by that. I think people are surprised by the fact that it goes down so much, so quickly because there are other instances, especially with vehicles where vehicles [00:49:00] maintain their value for a longer period of time, for a longer period of time.
And uh, I was just doing some Google searching on this because, you know, we’re kind of thinking about, um, William and cars and that sort of thing for him and I, I just typed in like, what is the most value car out there, value truck or whatever. And it’s a lot of Toyota stuff, right? It’s Toyota Tundras and Tacomas in particular, top one and two.
You buy used one of those for 10 grand and sell it in 10 years for 10 grand. Like they’re, or 20 or whatever the number is. Like they seem to hold their values for a long time. And I guess that’s just a reflection on, to your point, the length of that, that product being around. It’s not a new thing, it’s a truck that’s been around for, I.
50 years.
Joe: Yeah. It’s already been proven reliable. It’s, and I feel like for some people this is, this is what we were getting at on Monday with consumerism and really og you made a good point. When, when you were like, uh, you know, for you, the tickets that you bought were for whatever game was not based [00:50:00] on showing you that you have a cool new thing.
But if you’re gonna get on the in on the cool new thing and it is to show other people that you got the cool new thing in a lot of cases, this, I mean, look at the Apple headset that they’re just retiring and Tim Cook and Company are now saying they’re gonna redo that. But remember how cool those advertisements were?
No. And then when you saw with people on there, they were never cool.
Doug: Yeah. You talking about the VR or are you talking about the Over the ear headphones? Yeah, the Vision Pro. The vr. Yeah. Where you
Joe: can see everything, but Right. I saw these two dudes sitting at lunch together and they’re both wearing these headsets.
Like, what are you doing? It just, and yet when you first saw the commercials, it looked really, really cool and now you already know og, two years from now, nobody’s gonna be able to get rid of that thing.
OG: Yeah. I never thought they were cool to begin with, so I didn’t think that when I saw them. That’s the cost of the new new, right.
Yeah. I mean. Oculus. I mean, if you’re looking at technology, the little, you know, Google Vision, Google glasses or whatever they had, [00:51:00] even iPhones when they first came out. I mean, look at all the upgrades that happen. Even now, it’s, you go, I can’t get a chip. That’s faster than the last. Yeah, you
Joe: only have the five.
What are you doing? Like what kind of dinosaur
Doug: are you? Maybe I dozed off for a second, but why are we talking about this? Like how does this relate to people’s long-term budgeting and spend, like, let’s make this real. We’re talking about depreciation. How do we tie this into either our investment strategies, our vision statement, or our day-to-day finances?
Joe: Well, two things. Number one we discussed there is two different types of ways to think about depreciation. If you’re a business owner, this can be a great write off on your taxes. But if you’re buying into a new technology, we talked about consumerism, there can be a monster cost. And I think when we’re looking at the new new, we gotta know that if the new new isn’t gonna be the hot thing, three years from now, I’m gonna pay this huge, huge cost upfront for something that I might not have value the way that I thought.
Or there’s a cost [00:52:00] attached to that. Valuing the new,
Doug: yeah, so it’s like buying Rivian stock. When I bought Rivian stock and I thought it’s the hot new thing when that thing iPod, I’m like, how can this not win? Tesla was going crazy at the time when Rivian came out and I liked a lot of the intrinsics value of, and the fundamentals of that business at the time.
I paid a price for that. Being an early adopter and, and how that stock depreciated,
Joe: look at it as an example. Like I’ve got the Sonos system and Sonos completely abandoned. Their old system goes, you know what? We have a new one. I had like eight of those speakers. Now trying to get rid of those speakers that are barely supported by the company.
They actually made an app that if you’ve got just legacy stuff, that you can still use it. I don’t know how long that’s gonna be supported, but I think to really put a point on this, which I’m glad you brought that up, Doug, is if you’re not thinking about depreciation when you’re buying the new, new thing, when you’re buying into technology, you’re making a mistake.
There was also a lawsuit, Doug, that you might’ve seen where, uh, video game players were [00:53:00] suing a company because the makers of the video game, the crew, uh, I believe it was Ubisoft,
aftershow: they
Joe: just decommissioned the game. And these players are these, the only way to play it is online. Like, wait a minute, you sold me a good No, no, no.
You look at the ULA, what? Isn’t that what it’s called? The ULA? The, the, the user license Agreement. Yeah. User license said, no, no, no, you don’t actually own this game. You were leasing the game. You were buying the right to play the game, and now the game’s gone. So you paid 60 bucks for this thing that was gonna last five years, and now it’s, now it’s gone.
Right? Nobody reads those. I thought this was a good headline, specifically for a week when we’re just talking about consumerism, I will link to this in the show [email protected] Doug. Out on the back porch, man. We’ve had a lot of great discussions around some of our previous episodes. It was funny, I was chatting with a couple stackers, one who told me, uh, stacker Jason, who told me specifically, he’s like, I didn’t use to care about theme [00:54:00] parks, and now I get excited every time Robert Niles is on the show.
So another great appearance by Robert Niles a few weeks ago. That was on Monday of that week and on Wednesday, a lot of people, a lot of chatter around the discussion we had on the Jail Collins episode, which Doug, I think you might have in front of you.
Doug: I do, yeah. We got a great post in the basement from David Berman, who’s a rising contributor.
Congratulations David on being named a rising contributor. He says by Facebook, I love the mo. It’s quite an accomplishment. I’d tell your mom. Uh, I love the most recent episode you guys just did with JL Collins. Both segments were great. Probably the best and well-rounded episode in a while. Uh, I love the interview with JL.
Haven’t heard the Minister and monk story before, but I’ve said it for a long time that the parable of the fishermen in the businessmen changed my life. No joke. I saw the story and a sign in a Jimmy John’s in college, and it changed my perspective in the course of my life. If
Joe: it’s on a wall of a Jimmy John’s, it must be.
Doug: Life changing. I mean, we can kind of make fun of that, but on the other hand, you [00:55:00] never know when inspiration is gonna hit you. It could be a bumper sticker that just catches you at the right time because of the other stuff that’s happening in your life. And I think it’s pretty awesome that, you know, he was in something as innocuous as a subs shop and found something that changed his whole outlook on life.
He goes on about that. But then, uh, in his next paragraph, he says In the Better Call Saul segment. I also thought it was a great discussion and deep dive. I agree with your answer completely. I’m amazed though that not once during your answer, did any of you say the words market cap or market waiting.
Joe: We were talking about for people that, uh, don’t remember this episode.
A few weeks ago. We were talking about the efficient frontier and talking about getting more, uh, a little more scientific with your investing. And the reason we want, we, I mean we had J Collins, which was really for people starting out. And then I love the fact that our color that day was for people that need to be more scientific, which is when your portfolio is a little larger.
So we didn’t talk about market cap or market waiting.
Doug: No, but I will say as I listened to that episode in its [00:56:00] finished form the other day when I was out hiking, I did love that we got almost prescriptive. We got detailed. I love that deep dive in that Better Call Saul segment. Um, but there was a major problem with David’s post here and I, I called him on it.
Uh, I don’t know if you saw this Joe, but as I read through it and I thought this was really nice to hear, thank you David. Um, love the detailed sort of critique and ’cause it was positive. Definitely loved it. So he kind of broke it up, you know, the beginning of it was just like the show structured. The beginning of this review was also how, you know, it was, it was the interview with JL Collins, which is was an amazing interview.
That Guy is, is great to listen to. And then he jumped right to the Better Call Saul Segment. I’m like, wait a minute. In between. There is my trivia. Oh my God. So, oh, time to move on. Yeah. So I’m like, David, I, I replied to him. I’m like, Hmm, there seems to be something missing in this post right about here.
And I, I pointed an arrow to the white [00:57:00] space between the two. David, the ball’s on this guy. David says, I love you, Doug, and I think your increased participation in the show has made it substantially better over the years. And here’s where it drops off a cliff. But I still skip through your trivia every episode, except for on Friday, buddy.
Yeah. Oh my goodness. You’re dead to meet David. You’re dead to me. Oh,
Joe: see.
Doug: A little something for everybody. Apparently you just put a huge smile on Joe’s face by saying that, David.
No. ’cause I often write the trivia.
Joe: Screw you, David. Oh, that’s, that’s great. Well, thanks for the great discussion and the kind words. Lots of people wrote us about J Collins and that was great to see. And it was great that we finally got to meet the guy after all these years. Finally got to have a sit down with JL.
You can find that just the week before Memorial Day Monday, Robert Niles, and Wednesday JL Collins. That’s gonna do it for today. Big thanks to all [00:58:00] of you for listening. If you know somebody who really might be spending too much money, I think today’s episode Monday might be good ones to point them toward.
So if you’ve got a friend, go, Hey, listen to these two. You know, you don’t gotta tell ’em, Hey, does that really something that you wanted to buy? Probably don’t say that. Just say, oh, I listened to this great podcast. So thanks to everybody who’s done that has, has done that as well. Doug, you’re gonna wrap up though, the big three.
Doug: Are you sure? You need to buy that new expensive pocket knife? Why don’t you listen to this
Joe: episode
Doug: first? Yeah, that’s gonna go over as well as I’d like to talk to you about the way you parent your children. That’s,
Joe: that’s probably how well that’s gonna be received. I think the kinder, gentler way is just say, I got a great podcast that you might wanna listen to.
All right. Right,
Doug: right.
Joe: Doug, what are the big three things on our to-do list after today?
Doug: Well, Joe first takes some advice from Katie. How much are you spending on consumerism? Decide what truly lights you up and spend more in those areas. But cut anything that’s not serving you. Second, thinking about buying that quirky car or electric [00:59:00] artwork.
Values change with time, not just based on the value of the piece, but also on what’s going on in the economy. Keep your investing game solid with more reliable funds, especially if you’re counting on them for financial independence later. But the big, listen, if you’re gonna ever help me fold T-shirts, learn to do it the proper way.
If you put the crease down the middle of the shirt, it’s gonna show up later when you wear it. Come on. It’s basic folding people. Some of you have clearly never worked at a gap in the summertime. Oh, I did. It was the worst job I’ve ever had. Six weeks in a gap. Oh. And all I did was stand there with, they had this little folding board, and you gotta fold the shirts over the board perfectly so they all stack perfectly.
Oh my God. Have a fake smile and go,
Joe: welcome in. Yes, I did. Welcome in. Yep. And while the background you’ve got,
Doug: thanks to Katie [01:00:00] Gatty Tossin for joining us. Today you’ll find Katie’s new book, rich Girl Nation, in our Stacking Benjamin’s bookshop. We’ll also include links in our show [email protected]. Hold on, we have a bookshop. Oh, hey, all the cool authors are there. You don’t have room for an office for me?
I’m still over by the water heater, but we’ve got a bookshop now. Time to move on. Probably like a cafe in the back and cool music with music going
Joe: and the baristas are going. Welcome in
Doug: Berets. This show is the property of SB podcasts, LLC, copyright 2025, and is created by Joe Sul Sea. Hi, Joe gets help from a few of our neighborhood friends. You’ll find out about our awesome [email protected], along with the show notes and how you can find us on YouTube and all the usual social media spots.
Come say hello. Oh yeah. And before I go, not only should [01:01:00] you not take advice from these nerds, don’t take advice from people you don’t know. This show is for entertainment purposes only. Before making any financial decisions, speak with a real financial advisor. I’m Joe’s Mom’s neighbor, Duggan. We’ll see you next time back here at the Stacking Benjamin Show.[01:02:00]
aftershow: The tribute question inspired
OG: me to remember this, uh, bit from Saturday Night Live, not about the Declaration of Independence, but rather about the Constitution and, and some of the amendments to the Constitution. I, I don’t know if you guys have heard this before,
bit: and so we are resolved. The First Amendment to our constitution is as follows, Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, of abridging, the freedom of speech, or of the press, or of the right of the people peaceably to assemble and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
Well done gentlemen. The First Amendment. Alright. Alright, now, what shall we discuss next? What is the second most important principle of our nation? Good.
Excuse me. God, [01:03:00] I don’t hate that. Well, I do. It’s ridiculous. So what is your name? Matt. Matt. What? Matt, don’t you worry about? Well, Matt, what will posterity say of us if the second right we enshrine in this document is simply guns that we don’t play. Damn, that’s actually kind of sick. Yes. No, no, no. The idea is ludicrous.
Wait. Now, hold on. I mean, we did just make a law that said anyone can say whatever crazy stuff they want. Right? Maybe this gun thing would kind of balance that out. Bingo. Okay. Yes. But by the same token, wouldn’t having a gun embolden people to say crazy stuff as well, bro? What? Yeah. No. What take That makes sense gentlemen.
We [01:04:00] cannot just have an amendment that says guns, but what about guns? Having them, Ooh, mother smart. Like who is this guy? Why ist he running this? Matt, I am open to discussing guns for a later amendment, but I must insist we move on to a more pressing concern. You are screaming so angry. Sir. Where are you from?
Exactly. America.
OG: As he, as he is lighting a cigarette with a candle. He’s just got like a cigarette. He said he got. Glasses on. He kind of puts ’em down and just, is this
Joe: Chappelle, was that Chappelle?
OG: No, no. It’s, uh, alter. I didn’t recognize any of those voices.
Joe: Who was the guest? I remember it, it sounded like Mikey, uh, Mikey, what’s his name from SNL.
Um, if only I could look that up. They’re just,
OG: he’s just like chilling in the background. He’s like guns. What about ’em? Having them, [01:05:00] you do kind of wonder how that went down Right. And stuff. They’re just like sitting around going, well, this is great and all, but, uh, we, we probably need to make some changes right away.
Like, uh. Like how did that go? How was the conversation? Just like he said, right? This was a very important first amendment to our great constitution. You could da da rattle off. What is the next one? Hmm? Guns. Guns. See? Are we sure That’s the second most important thing. Yep. Yep. I
Joe: dunno. Yeah. Mikey Day. Mikey Day.
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