If your bank account is thriving, but your soul feels bankrupt, are you really living your best life?
In this thought-provoking episode of The Stacking Benjamins Show, we dive into the deep end of personal finance, tackling life’s biggest questions with humor, insight, and a dash of holiday banter. The discussion starts with festive neighborly rivalries (think over-the-top decorations and holiday antics) but transitions into an emotional exploration inspired by a powerful piece written by Jonathan Clements for his Humble Dollar blog. Reflecting on his cancer diagnosis and thoughts on mortality, Clements’ writing serves as a springboard for a candid conversation about regrets, risk, and how to make the most of our limited time.
With additional insights from Paula Pant and Doc G, this episode layers humor with depth, offering practical advice on living purposefully while keeping your financial house in order.
Why You’ll Love This Episode:
- Explore how to balance financial strategies with meaningful life choices.
- Gain perspective on managing regrets and making peace with life’s uncertainties.
- Discover why generosity and appreciating the little things are the ultimate forms of wealth.
Episode Highlights:
- Holiday hilarity: Over-the-top decorations, fish sticks, and birthday antics.
- Jonathan Clements’ reflections on mortality and embracing the present moment.
- Paula Pant and Doc G’s insights on purposeful living and financial balance.
- Strategies for managing risk, reward, and estate planning challenges.
- The transformative power of generosity and savoring simple joys.
Trivia Fun:
It’s the final trivia showdown of the year! Can OG claim victory, or will this be another epic trivia blunder? Tune in for the laughs, the guesses, and a few surprising facts.
Takeaways to Ponder:
Jonathan Clements’ reflections remind us that while building wealth is essential, so is living a life filled with purpose, generosity, and connection.
Deeper dives with curated links, topics, and discussions are in our newsletter, The 201, available at https://www.StackingBenjamins.com/201
Enjoy!
Watch On Our YouTube Channel:
Our Topic: Regret avoidance or life maximization
The C Word (The HumbleDollar)
During our conversation, you’ll hear us mention:
- The connection between money & regret
- Regret avoidance
- Personal motivations
- Risk control
- Balancing risk mitigation and living for today
- Living with uncertainty
- Focus on what you can control
- Estate planning
- Making emotional decisions
- Building the right team
- The importance of open communication
- Legacy planning
- Appreciating the simple things in life
- Generosity
Our Contributors
A big thanks to our contributors! You can check out more links for our guests below.
Doc G
Another thanks to Doc G for joining our contributors this week! Hear more from Doc G on his show, Earn & Invest podcast at Earn & Invest on Apple Podcasts.
Check out his book Taking Stock: A Hospice Doctor’s Advice on Financial Independence, Building Wealth, and Living a Regret-Free Life.
Paula Pant
Check Out Paula’s site and amazing podcast: AffordAnything.com
Follow Paula on Twitter: @AffordAnything
OG
For more on OG and his firm’s page, click here.
Doug’s Game Show Trivia
- In what year did Sir Francis Drake’s 3-year around the world journey begin?
Mentioned in today’s show
Join Us on Monday!
Tune in on Monday when we’re joined by Thais Gibson who mentors us on how to get out of our own way and stop self-sabotaging in the new year.
Miss our last show? Check it out here: Holiday Ready? Essential Fire Safety to Save Lives and Cash! (SB1614).
Written by: Kevin Bailey
Episode transcript
[00:00:00] bit: As I reach up to place the angel on top, I look out my window and I see my neighbor, Doug, across the street, snapping together his artificial tree. [00:00:11] Doug: He’s like the perfect combination of Mussolini and Seacrest. [00:00:15] bit: Easy peasy. Poor, lazy, deplorable Doug, who cares more about convenience than the happiness and respect of his town, of his country, of our [00:00:32] Doug: live. From the basement of the YouTube headquarters, it’s the Stacking Benjamin Show. [00:00:48] I’m Joe’s mom’s neighbor, Doug, and on today’s show, how’s your holiday season as your favorite aunt or uncle shared money tips at a holiday party? Yet if they did, don’t listen to them. They were drunk, and if not. On today’s show, let’s share the basics according to one of the great minds in personal finance, Jonathan Clements. [00:01:08] To help us dive into Jonathan’s work, we welcome the woman who starts by telling you that you can afford anything. Pull a pant and the guy who tells you to always earn and invest in listening to podcasts. That is Doc G. And just like that favorite uncle who never smiles while he is telling you to pull his finger, it’s og. [00:01:31] And of course. Let’s take a pause halfway to feature our last trivia segment of 2025. Looks like today’s my last day of work and now a guy who’s ready to share some advice with the kids. It’s Joe Saw. See how, [00:01:51] Joe: Hey, there stackers. Happy Friday in the middle of the holiday season. I’m super happy that we’re here with you and I feel like we have, uh, take a podcaster to alternate work day today. We’ll get to that in a second. Let’s say hi to the guy across the cart table from me, though, whose purpose is to be the guy across the card table from me. [00:02:12] Mr. OGs here. How are you man? [00:02:14] OG: Uh, I [00:02:15] Joe: I’m fantastic. [00:02:16] OG: Uh, thank you so much for asking, sir. [00:02:18] Joe: Did not sound to, I sounded like, um, I’m okay. No, [00:02:22] OG: I’m perfectly great. Yes, I’m very, very much, uh, happy to be here. [00:02:27] Joe: Somebody has a birthday coming up. By the way, would you know who that is? [00:02:30] OG: Oh indeed. [00:02:32] Joe: Yes. [00:02:32] OG: Jesus [00:02:36] Joe: and og. Is that a coincidence? I don’t know. Might might. He might not be. And here is the guy who’s excited to talk about purpose. ’cause rumor has it. He might have a book coming out on the topic. I haven’t heard anything about it though. Doc Cheese’s here. [00:02:49] Jordan: How are you man? I’m good. You know what my purpose is kicking ass on trivia baby. [00:02:56] Joe: Throwing down the gauntlet. [00:02:58] Jordan: I’m, I’m bringing it today. I’m only gonna be off by like six figures instead of seven. [00:03:06] Joe: Every boy has a dream doc. Every boy has a dream for sure. And yours is, is to not be off by seven figures on trivia. And by the way, let’s welcome our people who are here, uh, working, uh, other jobs. [00:03:18] A woman who’s been in the fields all day working. ’cause she’s got the overalls on it’s farmer, Paula Pant. How’s the farmer doing? Yeah. [00:03:26] Paula: Oh, you know, the overalls are great. And you know what, these are rented, these are rented overalls [00:03:34] Joe: because who would buy overalls? [00:03:37] OG: Okay. [00:03:41] Things are tough in the Paula Pant universe. [00:03:45] Paula: Oh geez. Like you mean those are a cry for help is what those are. [00:03:49] OG: I know. I, I will donate my winnings to the Paula Pant charity to help her buy her own pants. [00:03:58] Joe: I know Paula’s already thinking about is this podcasting thing doesn’t work out. I’ve got a job at a cornfield somewhere. [00:04:04] That’s exactly it. [00:04:05] Paula: I’m telling you, overall’s year round, they’re comfortable. It’s like better than a belt to keep your pants on your body. [00:04:11] Joe: I, yes, correct. It’s, uh, I don’t know if anybody [00:04:17] OG: has any trouble keeping their pants on. It’s, it’s Paula. [00:04:25] I was trying to decide like in real time, like, can I do it? Can I do it? Is it too far? Did I say it? Not too far. I think it’s okay. I’m gonna do it and now it’s out. [00:04:33] Joe: Well, it’s okay OG because she’s not the only person who’s looking at another job. Apparently, uh, neighbor Doug selling fish sticks after the show because you’re like, he’s dressed like, is that an Ascot? [00:04:46] This is Paul’s cousin or something. [00:04:49] OG: Why do you have seven layers of clothes on? It’s not that [00:04:54] Jordan: I believe you’re, is that an Ascot? Is he wearing an Ascot? What is that thing around his neck? I don’t know. You have a quarter zip that a winter coat. He needs a pipe. He does need a pipe. He needs a pipe. He’d be perfect. [00:05:10] He totally needs a pipe. [00:05:13] Joe: And talk about the winter swells. Gordon’s [00:05:15] OG: fish sticks. I love it. [00:05:20] Joe: Oh, this is gonna be fun. Hey, today guys, we do have a very serious topic today, which is, uh, one of the top minds of personal finance. You know, there are so many different topics in personal finance. There’s so many voices and oh my goodness, if you’re on social media, in any of these social media groups, it can eat your soul. [00:05:37] Hearing all of these dif different opinions. But there are a few people whose opinions when they give them are incredibly, been incredibly valuable to my life. And one of those people have been a guy that was a personal finance columnist at the Wall Street Journal for a long time. I. Now the editor and creator of a blog called The Humble Dollar, Jonathan Clements. [00:05:57] And, uh, Jonathan is out with some, with some great advice about, I think’s great to share at the end of the year. What is this all about? What train are we on as we all work toward a better future for ourself? Having more money, Stacking up some Benjamins, affording anything, earning, earning and investing as much as we can, right? [00:06:14] What is this truly about? So we’re gonna dive into Jonathan and some tips that he has today. But before that, we’ve got a couple sponsors that make this show go so that we can keep on keeping on and make it free for you. We’re gonna hear from them, and we’re gonna dive into advice from Jonathan Clements here at the end of the year. [00:06:41] Today’s piece, as I mentioned earlier, comes to us from The Humble Dollar is written by Jonathan Clemens. And for people that aren’t familiar with Jonathan’s work, I’m just gonna read the open to this piece about why it’s so important. He says, on Sunday morning, and by the way, this was written back in June, but I saved it for now. [00:06:58] On Sunday morning, I was enjoying croissants and coffee with Elaine at the kitchen table while watching the neighborhood Sparrows finches cardinals and squirrels have their way with a bird feeder always right in our little world, except I was a little wobbly when walking the result. I thought of balance issues caused by an ear infection. [00:07:13] It’s gonna be a busy week, and I figured it’d be smart to get some antibiotics inside me even if visiting the urgent care clinic on Sunday might be more expensive than contacting my primary care physician on Monday and perhaps having to go in for an appointment. Long story short, I ended the day in an intensive care unit of a local hospital where the staff discovered lung cancer. [00:07:33] That’s metastasized my brain and a few other spots. This, as you may imagine, has been a few changes in my life and there will be more to come and then he jokes. I have no desire for humble dollar to become humble. Death watch, but my prognosis is not good. I’ve had three brain radiation treatments and I started chemotherapy. [00:07:51] And by the way, his prognosis still here in December is not good. Big shout out to Jonathan and we’re always thinking about him, but Jonathan has done a wonderful job of thinking about us. Jonathan’s always cranked out great work, but this piece is just absolutely amazing. He’s got seven points about really life and what this all kind of means. [00:08:13] Jordan, let’s start with you. Which one of these points, and don’t go to the last one immediately, the one about purpose. Uh uh. Let’s start with one of the top six. Which one of these points of Jonathan’s really stood out to you that are one of the big life lessons he shares with us here? [00:08:28] Jordan: Money and regret are intimately tied together, and I really actually see this, so as you guys may or may not know, I’m a hospice doctor, so I deal with people. [00:08:38] On their deathbeds, I deal with end of life. And people often talk about what they regret and they say things like, you know, I never had the energy, courage, or time to do X, Y, or Z. But instead of energy, courage, or time, sometimes it just comes down to money. A lot of people never felt like they had the money to do the things they wanted to do. [00:08:55] They had to go to work instead of go play. They couldn’t buy the thing or get the experience ’cause they didn’t have the money to do it. And so I think unfortunately, while it doesn’t have to be this way, I think for the grand majority of us, money and regret really are intimately tied together. And often the lack of money or worries about money can keep us from doing things that are deeply important to us. [00:09:18] Paula as [00:09:19] Joe: Jordan’s talking about this. At first I thought he was gonna go one way, but really talking about regret kind of brings up the carrot in the stick, doesn’t it? I feel like for some people it’s the carrot. I wanna have more money, I wanna have more life. But for other people, to doc’s point, it’s much more about I wanna make sure I don’t regret things later. [00:09:37] And that’s the reason. Which one was it for you? What made you really start saving? Was it, I don’t wanna regret later or I just want more flexibility? [00:09:47] Paula: What made me start saving was total anxiety about, about the future. So it [00:09:52] Joe: was, it was trying to avoid regret. [00:09:54] Paula: So yeah, it was regret avoidance. It was regret minimization, but not in terms of life experiences, but in terms of, you know, I didn’t want to be a senior citizen who suddenly realizes that they are. [00:10:08] Ill prepared. And so even when I was in my twenties, I was thinking ahead to that and trying to do whatever I could to ward off, you know, I was like, look, right now I’m, I, I’m young, so I have time on my side. Let’s do what we need to do now so that I don’t enter my sixties or my seventies, and regret the choices that I made in my twenties. [00:10:28] Joe: Oh gee. As I think about regret, I think about, um, Susie Orman and there is, and, and the fact that I will never own a private island and can’t invest. Uh, what, what, what’s the big number? 10 bajillion dollars. Paula, that she said on your show that you had to have, [00:10:44] Paula: uh, she said you needed a minimum of 10 million in order to retire, but she also said that she herself had I think around 20 to 25 million flex. [00:10:52] Joe: Yeah, [00:10:52] Paula: I mean, that was, that was in 20 $18. So you have to adjust it for inflation. [00:10:57] Joe: Yes, but I won’t give credit where credit’s due. Susie said something, that was the first time I really thought about regret with money, maybe seven or eight years ago, she said to everybody that thinks they can’t save. Now, imagine you’re 70 years old and you’ve never saved I. [00:11:13] How are you gonna feel then and OG? For me, where I didn’t think regret really worked. All of a sudden I went, man, maybe I should save faster. Like I was saving pretty good even when I heard that and I was sure I was on the right path and I’m like, maybe I need to go, go, go. How often do you see with your clients OG that it’s the stick versus the carrot that really gets ’em moving? [00:11:31] OG: Yeah, I don’t think it’s the stick very often you don’t, I think you [00:11:34] Joe: don’t see the regret thing. [00:11:36] OG: No, I don’t. And maybe because people who are entertaining the idea of working with professionals around money already understand they’re kind of already past the, the Paula stage of like, well I gotta do something. [00:11:48] Like I, I know I’m, do you know, I’m doing this. I just need to like optimize it to do it faster, better, or more efficiently or something. Because I find it’s really difficult to convince somebody of the negative thing in the future. You know, it’s interesting that you were talking about that ’cause I was thinking about the concept of saving and investing. [00:12:06] ’cause I. Who else but me just sits on their phone on the HP calculator and does present value calculations and goes, alright, if I need this amount of money, if I just save this, I guess, can I do that? You know? So for me it’s much more of a, what does that financial independence turn into in terms of lifestyle. [00:12:24] That’s kind of how I think about it. I don’t think about like, oh God, I’ll be 70 without money. ’cause then I just go, I’ll just keep working. You know, do something. But I look at it the other way and go, but if I can figure out a way, if I could only save 600,000 a year for the next 15 years, then I’ll be set. [00:12:42] You know, it’s like, oh, is that all you know? Okay, well let’s break it down by day, by months instead. Okay, that’s only 50,000 a month. Okay, that’s still not gonna work. You know, like dividing it by 12 makes it easier. But my point is, is for me, it’s much more about what it gets me. I think for our clients, they’re strong achievers also. [00:13:01] And sometimes you gotta use that stick part a little bit. And I think maybe more of that’s around some blind spots that people have, like we talked about on Wednesday, maybe a little bit around insurance or estate planning or something like that, where it’s just like, I don’t think I have to do that. [00:13:13] It’s like, whoa, whoa, whoa. Yeah, you do. Because if you don’t, the government’s gonna take half your stuff or your minor child is gonna have to go to court to get money to buy food and groceries. You know, you have to kind of use that like picturesque, like it’s gonna suck unless you do it this more efficient way. [00:13:30] But I don’t know about the savings things. Most of our conversations are about freedom and about like, what does this get us the opportunity to do, uh, in, in terms of where we are? So we’ve saved this money. What does it mean? Can I go to 80% time now instead of full-time? Can I take Fridays off? Can I save a little bit less, take a lower stress job? [00:13:50] Like those sorts of things. Not so much like if I don’t save, I’m screwed. [00:13:53] Joe: It’s funny you say that because during my career as a financial planner, I didn’t see enough people that weren’t doing enough and needed to do more. It was generally people, to your point, og, that were already on the right track and needed it rearranged better. [00:14:07] Yeah. I would always get so excited when I could actually help somebody figure out a way to get the right savings amount to finally put them over the edge. Like those were great moments. It was so, so fun. But sadly, I think that is the vast majority of people. But even, even for those people, doc, I think this idea that he presents my first thought when he says money’s intimately bound up with regret. [00:14:33] I do think that regret is a useless emotion. ’cause you can’t go back and change it. There’s nothing [00:14:39] Jordan: that you can do. Oh, oh, oh. So it depends on who we’re talking about, right? I think regret is a useless emotion on your deathbed because you don’t have a lot of agency to go back and change things. You don’t have energy, you don’t have time, et cetera. [00:14:54] But I think regret is very useful in young people. So if you can look forward and say, if I was on my deathbed, I found out I was gonna die tomorrow and I would really regret X, then I can flip that around and turn it into what I call a purpose anchor. Something to start building purpose and activities around. [00:15:11] I’ll give a perfect example. Five, 10 years ago, if you had said, what will you really regret on your deathbed? If you, you find out that you’re going to die next week, it would be not traditionally publishing a book. Honestly, it was one of those big things for me. But I never had the courage to pursue it, but I was able to kind of turn that knowledge of, oh, I’d really regret this and turn that into actually a purposeful activity. [00:15:35] That’s funny. [00:15:36] Joe: I mean, to put it into context, this time of year, it’s kind of Ebenezer Scrooge, right? He gets visited by the three ghosts and sees all this stuff and goes, oh my God, I still have a chance. [00:15:44] Jordan: Yeah, and there’s another point to that too, and I think you were making the, so there’s a nuance. [00:15:48] There’s actually two different kinds of regret. There’s action, regret and inaction regret. A lot of what we talk about is inaction. Regret. I wish I did this thing and I didn’t, and I was thwarted for whatever reason. Maybe it was money, maybe it was something else. That’s inaction. Regret. There’s also action regret. [00:16:03] It’s like. I’m really sad. I, I drank and drive and got into that car accident and damaged everyone else’s car. Okay. I [00:16:08] Joe: was laughing ’cause I wasn’t thinking you were going that, that serious. So I apologize. [00:16:12] Jordan: Yeah, but that’s action. Regret. But I even think a lot of times when you have action regret, what you’re really regretting is that you didn’t make up for it. [00:16:19] Like you didn’t right the wrong, you didn’t go back and fix things or apologize or build something important off of it. So I think again, regret can be beneficial, but it’s hard for it to be as beneficial when you’re on your deathbed. ’cause you just don’t have a lot of agency to change things. [00:16:33] Joe: I was thinking of, uh, time or two and I’ve woken up and went. [00:16:36] I probably shouldn’t have gotten on social media after a few adult beverages. Like, maybe I need to put a little bit more velvet on that hammer with that person I disagreed with. No gerts. Paula, what’s another one on this list that you [00:16:48] Paula: really [00:16:49] Joe: liked? [00:16:50] Paula: I liked when he said that we, we can control risk, but we can’t eliminate it. [00:16:55] Mm. And he talks about how there have been very few occurrences of cancer in, in the history of his family. And so in his view it was a minimized risk, but clearly it wasn’t eliminated. That’s a particularly poignant example, but I think in a lot of ways, both big and small, we see ways in which we can try to probabilistically put ourselves into a decent spot. [00:17:23] But there are a lot of humans in the world and there are a lot of events that happen in the world. And when I say events, I mean like I went to work today. That is an event in the cornfield. Yeah, exactly. I put on overalls today. That’s an event and I don’t regret it. And you know, just law of large number states that with this many humans and this many events. [00:17:46] Sometimes you’re on that narrow side of probability where things just don’t go your in the way in which you want it to. [00:17:52] Joe: Well, and this is, we spoke with, uh, Seth Godin this fall on the show, and he was talking about strategy, Paula, and a phrase that he lo, that he used that I’m going to steal is he said, this is why a compass is better than a map. [00:18:08] Because it isn’t about laying out a plan that’s static. It’s about looking for your north. And then as things change like cancer or the car accident that Doc G talked about, or whatever thing comes your way, that you’ve got this compass to find your way back like this, Paula is the reason why we have an emergency fund. [00:18:26] Right? [00:18:26] Paula: Mm. Yeah, exactly. It’s that planning for the unexpected. [00:18:30] Joe: Yeah. Which, oh gee. I would think that dealing with. The law of larger numbers, meaning the average person out there, okay, a disability probably won’t happen to you, but working with let’s say, a hundred families, you probably see a disability happen to somebody fairly often, which means we should probably keep that in the cross airs. [00:18:51] OG: Well, I mean, look at the story that you sent Doug and I from Apple News a couple of hours ago about the, [00:18:57] Joe: oh, I didn’t do that. Doug sent that to us. [00:18:58] OG: Oh, Doug sent it. The The yes murder of the United Health, CEO, like down the street from Paula. I mean, I’m sure there’s more to the story and we’ll find stuff out as it comes, but a crazy person does a crazy thing at a crazy time and like he wasn’t thinking about it this morning. [00:19:15] Boy, I better be careful when I walk to work today. It was just, I’m going to a meeting or the wrong way driver, or whatever the case may be. I don’t know who said this, Joe. You’ll recognize it right away. But somebody who’s on the show and said, your story never ends when it’s supposed to. It always ends in the middle. [00:19:30] Joe: Yeah. Mike Baker. [00:19:32] OG: Yeah. At some level it’s a little bit of a dangerous way to kind of think because you’re like, well, you know Yolo right? You never, you don’t have to worry about tomorrow. ’cause I could get hit by a car on my jog, so why bother jogging? But you should probably still exercise. Right? You know, I could go to the gym and the barbell could crush my trachea and I could die. [00:19:52] Or I, which is why I don’t go to the gym or weaken. Exactly. You know, or I’m weak and in firm and I die from osteoporosis or whatever happens when your bones stop working. You know, it’s like, I guess you probably can’t die from that, but it’s a Sure [00:20:07] Paula: you fall, it’s, it’s a symptom [00:20:08] OG: for living a pretty crappy 15 years on the back backend, I suppose. [00:20:11] So, I mean, it’s a great phrase. You can work to minimize risks and you’re not gonna eliminate it because you just have to decide which one of those, which one of those is the greater crime. Right. Is it worse to be uncomfortable by working out or is it worse to. Old and and firm. [00:20:27] Joe: Well, which brings me to Doc, this whole idea that we talk about a lot in personal finance, which is plan for the worst. [00:20:36] But like you, you’ve and I have worked together for a long time. I’m an optimist, right? Things are always great. Tomorrow, things are gonna be fantastic. I think you hear about entrepreneurs in general. We are optimistic People, however, plan for the worst all the time. Like whenever online I hear somebody go, oh, I’m betting on the stock market to do 9%. [00:20:54] You’re like, oh, why don’t we bet on seven? Uh, hey, I’m keeping minimal amount of money. My emergency fund, eh, why don’t you keep a little more plan for the worst? I think Doc is [00:21:07] Jordan: a much better strategy. You know, it’s hard because I think we have to have a mindset of risk mitigation and reasonableness. But then I also think we have to have a little bit of Memento Maori, which is exactly what Jonathan Clements is bringing us. [00:21:19] Memento Maori. This idea of that we carry death with us every day. The knowledge of our own death. So that’s present in our thinking and about how we look at today and what we do and what we get involved in. And it is a balance because we do wanna realize that each day is sacred and we wanna take advantage of those things. [00:21:38] And we do wanna build a sense of the important things now as opposed to waiting 15 years for when we’re retired or when we have enough money. But on the other hand, we also wanna risk mitigate because we might live to 85 or 90 and we don’t wanna yolo all our money away today. And we have to be very reasonable. [00:21:55] And so I think, I think we all are faced with this difficult juggling act of keeping all of those things centered. And that’s why when someone like Jonathan Clemens talks very openly about what he’s going through. He’s reminding us that we have to do both. And I think that’s, you know, by telling about his experience, but then also by being very reasonable and talking about all these issues, uh, he’s telling us to both risk mitigate and to keep this idea that death is always with you and we have to also live [00:22:26] Joe: today. [00:22:27] It’s funny, I didn’t think about this going in. I did think this is appropriate for this time of year, which is why I left it for now. But I do think this is kind of the ebenezer screw story. [00:22:35] Jordan: It’s totally, [00:22:36] Joe: totally. You’ll [00:22:37] Jordan: be visited [00:22:37] Joe: by [00:22:37] Jordan: three ghosts. [00:22:39] Joe: We’re gonna do that. Uh, by the way, that episode, we’re gonna play it again on the 24th of December, Doug in the three ghost. [00:22:45] We’ll make a return appearance this year and should be a lot of fun. Actually, I take that back 25th of December. We’re gonna do that. So on Christmas day, og, uh, let’s end the first half with yours. Which one do you wanna point a finger at? [00:22:58] OG: Well, I’d have to go with money. Is is with uncertainty, you know, kind of certainty, uncertainty type of thing. [00:23:03] I, um, I know he. Talked about because of the uncertainty. It’s really difficult to, I think he said, but ever, ever more so than now. And I think what he means by that is him personally ever, ever, you know? Right. Like it’s uncertain for him personally right now because of timeframes. But I think that also goes back to what Paula was saying about risk. [00:23:23] And it’s like you can’t plan on, well, I’ll probably get hit by a bus when I’m 70. So clients give us a lot of grief over this. ’cause we plan for them to live to be a hundred and they go, well, hundred hundred, come on. And I said, well, hold on a second. No, no, no. You don’t understand. My grandparents were all dead in their eighties. [00:23:41] Okay. But your grandpa was born in 1900 also, where infant mortality was a thing. Just think about how lucky he was to make it to 12, let alone to 80. And now we’ve got the rate of change, the rate of healthcare change that’s happening and disease management and all this other sort of stuff. I don’t know what’s gonna happen over the next 50 years, but I bet it’s gonna happen faster than the last 50. [00:24:04] Do you wanna pick 90 and have that thing, that slope of that line hit zero right at 90 and go, whew, I’m out. Or should we make it a hundred, just, you know, or 110. [00:24:14] Joe: That’s my goal, man. If I put in the last quarter in the Coke machine, right as I have that last massive heart attack, like that’s perfect. [00:24:21] OG: Well of course it is. [00:24:22] So if you knew that for certain, then everybody could plan around it. But you can’t, so you have to plan for a longer time period. And then on the other side of it, you have to have plans for what if it doesn’t happen as fast because my family’s counting on me working for the next 10 years and saving some amount of money, not 50,000 a month. [00:24:42] That’d be nice. But that’s part of the plan too. And if I don’t get that part done, it’s not like, well, sorry it didn’t work out. We have to have plans for that. We have to have plans for the other side as well. And you know, hopefully the, the longer side works, but I don’t feel like it’s uncertain in a sense of like investing. [00:24:59] I think it’s an uncertain timeframe. That’s what makes it uncertain, [00:25:02] Joe: and I feel like when I read this, Paula, the first thing I thought about was investing, right? Because I was trying to look at it through the eyes of a new stacker. I. Somebody that’s just maybe starting out and they said managing money’s fraught with uncertainty, but never more so than now. [00:25:16] And the first thing I thought wasn’t Jonathan and his life, which is clearly OGI agree. This is what he’s talking about. It’s his life personally. Yeah. It’s more unc. But I thought about all those people that are on social media. You know, talking about the uncertainty around the election, the new administration coming in. [00:25:32] We’ve got all this uncertainty in the financial markets we’ve got. Who knows what’s going on with tech stocks? We’ve got all of this weirdness happening all over the place, the Federal Reserve. What’s gonna happen there? Like managing money’s fraught with uncertainty. The first thing Paula, brand new investors always do, as you know, is they go, well then I’m not going to invest. [00:25:52] Because that’s where the uncertainty is. How do you convince a brand new person, a brand new forwarder, stacker, earner? To twist that around and go, no, the whole reason you have to invest is because of uncertainty. [00:26:06] Paula: Hmm. I would say if you keep all of your money in cash, you will certainly lose purchasing power to inflation. [00:26:13] Joe: You will certainly go [00:26:14] Paula: nowhere. Yeah. Yeah. You will certainly end up having less money in purchasing power. That is a certainty. And if you keep all of your money in bonds or T bills, you know, if starting at the age of 20 the only thing you ever invest in is only bonds, you’ll certainly are not gonna reach your, your retirement goals. [00:26:36] You can have the certainty about a negative outcome or you can take some risk. Risk goes hand in hand with reward. So it isn’t about eliminating risk, it’s just about managing that risk to something that you can, that’s not gonna wipe you out. Something you can tolerate. [00:26:54] Joe: I thought given your getup today, you were gonna go, you know, you gotta plant the crop. [00:26:58] Like, just gotta teach people how to, to plant. And the growing season I was sure. And by the way, to go back earlier, I was surprised, as surprised as you were og that uh, Doug texted us that horrible news earlier today as we record this, uh, about that unfortunate incident because I thought he was out delivering fish sticks. [00:27:19] Like I had no idea he’d have time to read while he is on his route. [00:27:23] OG: It’s not joke time, Joe. [00:27:25] Joe: Sorry. Read the room. Joe. Uh, doc, I wanna go to you last because we’ve had a lot of death in my family this year. You see it every day. I’ve seen it more than I want to see it in a given year, just seeing it twice in a year. [00:27:42] But there’s so much uncertainty around that time for the family, for the person, for, for everybody. This idea that life is uncertain, like outside of drugs, right? How are you able to help people with this most uncertain time of their life? ’cause they don’t know. Nobody knows what’s coming next, [00:28:03] Jordan: believe it or not, even in the midst of uncertainty of our longevity, et cetera. [00:28:08] What we do try to do is bring in a certainty of controlling symptoms. Providing them a peaceful environment and allowing them to be with family and friends. And so when I get a cancer patient, for instance, and they’re reaching the end stages, I can’t tell them when we’re gonna, they’re gonna die. I can’t tell them how many good days they’re gonna have left. [00:28:26] But I can with certainty tell them that we will do our best to control your pain. That we’ve got these great medications and that if you wanna be home, we’ll try to provide the best nursing and the best care and try to give people something to look forward to every day, even in the midst of all this. [00:28:40] And I think there’s some certainty in that. You know, most people are you saying, wait a minute, hold on a second. Are you saying [00:28:45] Joe: for all of us, focus on what you can control? [00:28:47] Jordan: Yes. I’m a big fan of agency. Most people wake up every morning with a plan for the day. And let me tell you, the dying do just as much as the living. [00:28:57] Joe: Yeah. Yeah. I think that’s a great place to leave the first half. Let’s, uh, try to brighten this up a little bit, guys, and go to the most ridiculous part of our show, which is our trivia at the halfway point of the show. If you’re brand new here. We have had this year long trivia competition, which ends today. [00:29:15] And why don’t we get this outta the way? We’ve already declared a winner, OG this morning, received his prize from stacker. Eric, thank you so much stacker Eric, who donated a great gift, a milk bar gift certificate to OG and his family. And, uh, and it’s pretty, pretty exciting OG that you the last guy who needs it. [00:29:38] I know he’s so taken. He’s shedding a tear. That is, would you like to make a victory speech before we do today’s trivia? Og, now that you finally did it, [00:29:47] OG: I just wanna thank my, uh, my fans, both of them, my parents, uh, my lovely wife, Alyssa, she was with me every step of the way. My kids, Alex, William, and Caroline. [00:29:57] You know, this isn’t the end. This is just turning the page and we’re looking forward to another championship season next year. And, uh, you know, there is no off season for the og. It’s just, we just, we just go right into the next season. So we’re, uh. You know, it’s another ring. It’s another ring. We just, we just gotta, we just gotta keep filling up the hand. [00:30:17] Like the Pittsburgh Steelers. We need one for the phone. [00:30:20] Joe: I had so much fun this week in the Afford Anything Facebook group where someone in the afford Anything Facebook group said, I just gotta say when it comes to Stacking Benjamin’s trivia, I’m Team Paula. I wanna help Paula devise a way to BOG. And she said, we’re coming for you og. [00:30:37] We’re coming for you. Okay? Ooh [00:30:38] OG: yes. Bring the lumber as the kids say. [00:30:43] Joe: So Paula, I think you’ve got some people in the Afford Anything community. Maybe you need an advisory council next year to help you. [00:30:49] Paula: Hey, you know what, Jake Paul beat Mike Tyson, so, you know, [00:30:53] Doug: and what was [00:30:54] Joe: that? [00:30:54] Doug: That is more [00:30:55] Joe: scripted than my [00:30:55] Doug: trivia. [00:30:59] Joe: I would tell you my thoughts on that, but immediately we’ll get the circle of death that Netflix ad immediately. Oh my goodness. And I had a room full of people. Mm. Not a great night. Anyway, where were we? Oh yeah, our trivia. Doug, tell us what is the score? Because I think can Paula is still overcome Doc G slash Mom [00:31:20] Doug: for second. [00:31:21] Does she have a shot not overcome? I think she can tie, because the score I have is that OG has. Like 13,000. And then Joe’s mom and whoever’s been playing for Joe’s mom over the course of the year is 11, and I’ve got Paula at 10. So if Paula wins today, she can tie for second place. Paula got [00:31:38] Joe: to 10 and, uh, got within in Ty. [00:31:42] So Paula we’re saying there’s a chance [00:31:46] Paula: I, I have mixed emotions about that because losing trivia is just so on brand. [00:31:51] Jordan: I, I think, oh, no, no, no. Paula, you can’t, you can’t steal that from me. That’s my brand. You’re the afford anything person. Not everything. I’m the lose trivia guy. Wait, it’s just gonna be [00:32:00] Joe: like the NFL draft where it’s the last game of the year. [00:32:03] We’re both throwing the pick. Like Paul is like, I’ll say 9 billion. [00:32:08] Paula: I’m, I mean, I’m just, it’s losing. Trivia is such a core part of my identity. I don’t know what I would ever do without being in third place. Well, let’s, [00:32:17] Joe: let’s see if the future begins now, Doug, what’s our last trivia question of the year? [00:32:26] Doug: Hey there, stackers. I’m Joe’s mom’s neighbor, Doug, and in many ways I’m really sad this year is over. I mean, no more og gloating over yet another win. That’s gonna be tough to not hear that anymore. And to hear Paula have one of two choices and pick the wrong one, like every time, actually, now that I think about it, that’s statistically incredible. [00:32:49] I was able to do that. It takes a certain genius to crap. [00:32:53] Paula: I’ve, I’ve thought that too. [00:32:56] Doug: But like all good things, Doug’s trivia comes to an end. So here is the last question of the year. One of the first Benjamin Stacking Worldwide Tours began on today’s date by a guy named Sir Francis Drake. He sailed to exotic places like Fort Lauderdale because he heard the MTV Spring break crew was gonna be there, and even California. [00:33:18] Where, and I have this on good authority, he went to Knottsberry Farm. It could have happened. Hey, you don’t know. You don’t even know. Here was today’s question. What year did Drake’s three year party, I mean, journey began. I’ll be back right after I plot how I’m gonna get outta the basement after OG probably wins again. [00:33:39] And his head gets so big that it like squashes the rest of us outta the basement, like squirting us outta the windows, like pumpkin seeds. [00:33:47] Joe: Don’t even wanna imagine that. I will imagine. OG Guss first though, Francis Drake began his three year journey around the world today. Way back in what year? OG. [00:33:59] OG: So, to be fair, when you said Sir Francis Drake, I was like, Drake started a tour on today’s date. [00:34:05] Doug: He started his dis track. Know his first [00:34:07] OG: name was Francis. Interesting. It’s his cousin. I thought Drake was his first name or stage name, but I’m just not really up with the culture. But hey, whatever his name’s Francis. Cool. I mean whatever. Honestly, I’d probably hide it too. You know? That’s, that’s all I was thinking. [00:34:23] And then you, and then you started talking about sailing and I was like, oh, you’re talking about the maritime Drake way. Different guy, guy with the [00:34:29] Doug: funny collars. [00:34:30] OG: Yeah. Yes. Way, way, way. Different guy. [00:34:33] Paula: Oh, was the maritime, is that why you’re dressed like a fisherman with the, it’s to go with the theme. [00:34:38] OG: Somebody picked it up. It’s the theme. He’s a longshoreman. Uh, so Drake’s passage comes to mind and I, golly, I wish I could phone a friend here ’cause I feel like my kids are studying this right now. Um, we’ve heard that line before, but we have [00:34:53] Joe: just before somebody totally cheated at our trivia. [00:34:56] OG: Oh really? [00:34:57] Yeah. Uh, anyways, uh, let’s say I know exactly [00:34:59] Joe: how long the Dead Sea is, [00:35:01] OG: is, isn’t it? 487.2 meters? Um, I’m gonna say it was, uh, 1500 and uh, uh, see 1492. I think it was like 1582. I’m gonna say 1582. ’cause I think the Drake’s passage thing was like 1585. And you said three years? So I’m gonna say 15. 1582. 1582 [00:35:24] Joe: for OG Doc. [00:35:25] What are you thinking? You’re on mute. [00:35:31] Jordan: I have no clue. Um, came off mute to say that. Yeah. Yeah. [00:35:40] I think the 14 hundreds are too early. I think the 16 hundreds are too late. So I was falling kind of just right off the bat where OG landed. I. I am gonna say it’s 1550 and give Paul a wide swath of above or below, but I think OGs pretty close. We got [00:35:56] Joe: 1550 and 1588. Was that OGs? No, he said 1582. 1582. [00:36:04] Paula: Okay. [00:36:05] So when I heard the question, the first number that popped into my head was probably the 16 hundreds. So I’m gonna capture the upside and say 1583. Sure. You don’t wanna rethink that. [00:36:16] Joe: I’m, [00:36:17] Paula: I’m sure. [00:36:19] Joe: I dunno the [00:36:20] Paula: answer. I’m just saying just you’ve [00:36:22] Joe: been [00:36:22] Paula: confident before. Just watch. The answer’s gonna be like 15, 40 [00:36:29] Joe: and if it is, oh Lord. Oh man. All right, well who’s got this one? We’ll be right back and find out. Oh gee, you kicked this thing off by saying 1582 and then you heard the guess afterwards How you, you feeling confident. [00:36:47] OG: Yes, extremely. Because he’s since Googled it. I just, I didn’t Google it, but I think 1585 is the number, so I feel really close with that. [00:37:01] So 1582, and since they both gave me a lot of space, I know I’m good. [00:37:04] Jordan: All right then. Doc G, you said what year? I said, uh, 1550. And I have quite a bit of certainty that I’m in the right century. Ah, [00:37:13] Doug: you said fif, you said 5, 0, 15, 15, 15, 50. I thought, but Oh, I did You have 15. 15. That changes. No, I said 15. No, nothing. [00:37:24] No, [00:37:24] Jordan: no. 15, 15, [00:37:25] OG: 15. 15 is nothing. [00:37:27] Joe: And then Paula, you came through by saying 1583. 1583. A year after og 1583. Yeah. So let’s see who won this thing. Are you sure you didn’t google it, og? [00:37:40] OG: I didn’t. No, I don’t. I think it’s, I don’t know who [00:37:42] Joe: it is. You just talked very cock. I think it’s like [00:37:43] OG: 15. Yeah. No, no, no. [00:37:46] Because you know, I have nothing to lose, man. I really think it was 1585 was, was like when he got the Drake passage. I, I don’t know why I feel that number, but in which case that [00:37:56] Joe: that would mean Paula would be it. You shouldn’t. I was gonna say, yeah, but you said three, [00:37:59] OG: you said it took three years. So when did he start? [00:38:01] So I, 15 85, 80, 84, 85. Just doing some 82 plus three is 85, bro. Nice try. [00:38:08] Doug: Yeah. We’re not asking what year he finished. We’re asking what he at the beginning. All right. Give us the god darn answer. 85, argue minus three [00:38:16] OG: is 82. I’m right. Doug. What’s he Stop argue. Can [00:38:20] Doug: I just do my stuff here? Oh my God. People are all idiots. [00:38:26] Hey there, stackers. I’m your favorite history professor and guy who both ran and McNally looked to for help. Joe’s mom’s neighbor, Doug. This Francis Drake dude could have been a rapper in another life while he was the second in command of the English Navy. When they defeated the Spanish armada, his frequent victories made him a pirate to the Spaniards a who called him El Dra. [00:38:51] Seriously, why that guy didn’t get signed to a hip hop labels beyond me? But we can’t speculate on that. You know why? Spoiler alert. It’s because Drake died a long time ago. That’s why. [00:39:02] Joe: Thank you. [00:39:04] Doug: You don’t like dinosaurs? Can’t talk ’cause they’re all dead. And, and because I’ve got an answer to give you. Oh, thank God. [00:39:15] See Francis Drake started circling the globe just 27 years after Doc g thought. Six years before Paula thought and five years before OG thought the correct answer is 1577 on Thinking Fing og, a winner on [00:39:39] Joe: Fing brand, Paula Pant. Wow. Joe’s like, [00:39:42] OG: are you sure? Are you sure? [00:39:47] Jordan: I was not only in the right century, I was in the No. [00:39:52] Right half a century. Even I was close. That was just so painful to watch. [00:39:57] OG: It’s very close. So 1580, my bad. [00:40:01] Joe: Paul’s like hashtag nailed it. [00:40:02] Paula: Wow. Oh. [00:40:05] Joe: When your gut says Go left. [00:40:06] Paula: Well, it’s funny ’cause I was, the middle band was so narrow I was gonna capture either the upside or downside. So I was gonna go with either 1583 or 1549, both of which would’ve been wrong. [00:40:19] OG: You didn’t entertain 1581. She had [00:40:21] Paula: nothing. Yeah, just that middle band just seemed too narrow. [00:40:24] Joe: Oh man. Okay. Well, OG gets a Rich, get Richer, gets another lap around the track. Yes. Gets to wave at his fans. One more time, let’s jump into the second half of the show and dive into Jonathan Clements because he has, he has, well, four more, but the last one’s around purpose, which I don’t want to talk about. [00:40:45] Doc, let’s give you the first one for the second half, which one you wanna point to next. [00:40:51] Jordan: It is toughest on those left behind, and I think of this really in two different ways. And again, remember I’m a hospice doctor, so I see this all the time. One is toughest on those left behind because you have to deal. [00:41:02] With the will and the trusts and have to like sort everything out. And that is just a pain even when it’s well planned for. So first and foremost, dealing with someone’s estate sucks. The other side, and I always say this as a hospice doctor, is the person who’s dying. Their suffering ends, but unfortunately those who are left behind their suffering can last for decades. [00:41:22] In other words, when we feel badly around the death of a loved one, we carry that with us for long periods of time. And so I think it really is true. I think it’s really hard to watch someone you love die, and we carry that with us over time. Well, and [00:41:36] Joe: this brings up two different things. Let’s start with the estate plan og. [00:41:40] I think that what Doc G says is just spot on. This estate plan is just so important. [00:41:45] OG: Well, it’s really important and in most circumstances and in most cases, there’s absolutely nothing from a money standpoint that you have to do immediately. I. I was just talking with a friend of mine whose father had passed away and we were talking about something else and, and the topic of money and family came up and he goes, even though everything was all squared away, all of a sudden all the real feelings about the money came out. [00:42:12] Even though we knew this is how dad wanted it and this is how it was gonna be. And it was pretty simple to do. It was still the one relative who goes, I know I’m gonna get something, but just, can I get five grand right now? ’cause I got the thing going on that I really need. Oh boy. And then you get the guilt and the annoyingness of like, well no, because then if I give you five grand right now, I have to give everybody five grand right now and I’m not ready to do that because we’re still at the freaking hospital. [00:42:39] So how about we just settle down about who’s getting what, when, and you know, and it’s just a weird. Issue with money. It’s just a wild thing. And the, and the more that you can plan for that and, and I think do a service to your family and talk about it, here’s where the stuff is that’s super important, right? [00:42:59] Here’s the binder, here’s the phone number of the attorney. Here’s the, let me introduce you to the financial guy and the CPA so everybody knows who’s who. That’s great. But sit down and go through the darn thing and go, here’s how things are set up. And here’s what you should be thinking about. I have an IRA, if you take this freaking money in cash, you nim it. [00:43:17] You have to pay a bunch of money in taxes. Do you know when you find out you have to pay a bunch of money in taxes in 15 months after you spent all the money? So then you’re gonna find out, like your CPA is gonna go, wait, hold on. You took 180 grand outta dad’s a new, uh, IRA. Did you save 70 of that? [00:43:34] ’cause you have to pay taxes. I don’t save 70, you know, it’s like here’s where the money is, here’s what it means. And I think that’s part of your job if you’re going to be a steward of your wealth. The whole idea of an estate plan, right, is to like, not just go f it, who cares? The whole idea is to say like, I’m taking this and I’m trying to provide for the next generation or generations beyond me to just give them a big thick binder and go best wishes, hugs and kisses. [00:43:58] Dad. It’s like a half a step, but just go the full step and go, let me open this stuff up so that you don’t have to say, I’ve got a million dollars. But how about you talk about what an IRA is? Yeah. Why don’t you do some education and say, based on the tax laws right now, you’re gonna have to pay taxes on this and you should listen to what Josh says or whatever about some of these things. [00:44:17] Joe: We have a family member in charge of, uh, one of the estates who just is ill-equipped, just was clearly the wrong person. I feel bad for her, frankly because she’s an overhead and uh, because she feels. Inadequate. I, I feel this is, this is me projecting, but I feel like because she feels inadequate, she’s hiding stuff. [00:44:36] She’s not bringing anybody into the conversation. She, she just, she’s lost. I feel like she’s truly, truly lost. Not even the attorney. We’ve even talked to the attorney. Yeah. If [00:44:44] OG: you try to like help, then you’re the Yeah. You know, you’re the Yeah. The greedy in-law who’s get your fingers outta the bucket. [00:44:50] Joe: Yeah. It is super sad to watch and frankly, the person that passed away could have to your point, solved a lot of that by just having the family sit down ahead of time. You know, just one of my favorite questions that we fielded on your show, Paula has been OG brought this up, the feelings around money. [00:45:10] Remember that caller? Mm-hmm. That was talking about, I don’t know what to do with the, but sure. I know what to do about the money, but I wanna make, what was it I wanna make Dad proud or I really wanna make Yeah. Like the dollar bill doesn’t have emotion, Paula, and yet the estate has so much emotion. [00:45:25] Paula: Yeah. [00:45:25] We recently took a call from a listener who had inherited about a million dollars. Up until that point in his life, he was in his early thirties, he was naturally quite good with money. Yeah. Throughout his twenties and early thirties, he had always been a, a frugal and careful steward with money, but suddenly he had this big responsibility and with it came the emotional heft of knowing that, I think it was his father, his loved one sacrificed like though, basically that money represents hours of that person’s life. [00:46:03] Yeah. You know, and so by virtue of accepting that money, that inheritance, he was accepting all of the time, all of the sacrifice, all of the, the parties that that guy didn’t go to. [00:46:16] Joe: To build that fortune. [00:46:17] Paula: Exactly. The early mornings that, that, that guy woke up to a blaring alarm in 30 degree, you know, in freezing temperatures. [00:46:26] I was [00:46:26] Joe: really happy to read that because you know, the study after study shows people see inheritances, like it’s windfall found money and they do stupid stuff with it. [00:46:35] OG: Right. And [00:46:36] Joe: to feel that weight, I thought was, [00:46:38] Paula: I don’t know. It was a good thing. It was good. Right. He respects what went into the money. [00:46:43] Yeah. You know, he respects everything, all of the stress that went into creating that. [00:46:49] Joe: Paul, let’s stick with you. We got a couple left here. Which one of the two do you want to, uh, which one do you wanna stick with OG with? This is the last one. [00:46:59] Paula: Let’s see. We’ve talked about uncertainty. We’ve talked about regret. Have we talked about how the cliche is true? Something like this makes you truly appreciate life? [00:47:09] Joe: We have not, we haven’t talked about The cliche is true. We’ve not talked about generosity. Hmm. [00:47:14] Paula: Let’s say generosity is a good one to end on. [00:47:16] So let’s talk about how the cliche is true, especially [00:47:18] Joe: this time of year. It’s good to talk about generosity last. So let’s talk about the cliche. What’s he talking about there? Paula? Yeah. [00:47:23] Paula: So he’s saying that when, for him it was this cancer diagnosis and him seeing that the end is near, but the cliche of you start to appreciate the really small, simple things in life. [00:47:35] You appreciate the feeling of the sun when it hits your skin and warms it up. You appreciate the smell of a cup of coffee, a really freshly brewed cup of coffee. Like you appreciate all of these small things. That is a bit of a cliche, but sometimes things, things are cliche because they contain wisdom and so often we think that we need the big stuff. [00:47:58] We need the hiking Mount Kilimanjaro, but often it’s that fresh cup of coffee. [00:48:05] Joe: It is so funny. I always thought that spending more money would be. A bigger thing and a better thing. And don’t get me wrong, there are things in my life where I’ve enjoyed the hell outta spending tons of money. But it truly is the little things that make me appreciate, like when I do these epic adventures, like really what went into them and I appreciate them even more. [00:48:25] But Doug, you were even talking about this this morning. You were talking about just appreciating the, the snowfall around your house and putting on some snow shoes. Oh yeah. Just like this little tiny thing that, yeah, I [00:48:36] Doug: was, I was late to one of our recording sessions ’cause I was drinking an incredible cup of coffee in front of a fire looking outside at the snow falling. [00:48:44] And I just was enjoy like that moment. I just thought, just sit here for a minute, Doug. Don’t look at your phone. Just sit here for a second and soak this in. And there aren’t many of those. ’cause we are so easily distracted by so many other pieces of media. The phone not, you know, not the least of which is our, our phone. [00:49:02] But you don’t get many of those moments where you can tell yourself to pause ’cause you realize this is the good stuff. [00:49:07] Joe: It’s funny, Cheryl and I, when we really started examining our expenses and looking at what we truly appreciate, we found that when we’re really busy, we go out to restaurants more often. [00:49:18] But I truly don’t appreciate them and I don’t care. But what I do appreciate is. Turning on my nice speaker system, pouring a nice glass of wine and using good tools in my kitchen and making myself a home cooked meal. And now I tend to spend more money on creating a meal at home because I prefer the meal at home to going out to dinner. [00:49:41] We were out, went out to dinner on Monday and it was so stupid. It was just, and I’m at this restaurant just because we were tired and it was late and we’re like, oh, let’s just go have somebody feed us. [00:49:49] Doug: Did you get the blooming onion? [00:49:50] Joe: I, I should have gone there. I should have. I went to a local pizza place and I watched the manager get in a fight with a patron. [00:49:56] You called my manager Fat. Oh, it was just, it was awesome. What that, go on. [00:50:02] OG: Tell us more about this actually, it sounds like a fun story. That Park was, and then what happened? Oh, they’re both dressed in [00:50:07] Joe: overalls. It was, it’s incredible, but it is, it’s those little moments. I mean, for me, I realized I like the holiday season much more than the day of Christmas. [00:50:19] Like the day of Christmas is fine, but it’s so full of expectations that I put up my tree early this year. I listened to holiday music all, all season long, and this is it. This is the fun, like just the waking up and turning on the tree is half the fun for me. Oh gee. Let’s go to the last one then. [00:50:35] Generosity. It’s a great time to talk about generosity being in the middle of a season that for a lot of people, can tend to be a little selfish. You think so? I don’t know. Is it? I think it can be. I can think a lot of, I remember when I was younger, man, it was all about what can people get me? [00:50:50] OG: Well, yeah, when you’re like eight. [00:50:52] Sure. Or 26 or 12. I think some of it is environment too, because. It was funny, I was talking to Caroline, she’s eight, she’s in third grade, and she was very diligently getting everybody’s Christmas lists and writing ’em down of all the things like, what can I get you? What can, what do you want? And all this stuff. [00:51:10] And so she’s texting me two nights ago and, and she said, what do you think about this? I mean, she’s like, on the, it’s not like she’s in the other wing of the chalet, right? She’s upstairs, but she’s texting me. And so she’s, she’s like, uh, and I said, well, I think we’ll do this. And he, she goes, no, I already talked to grandma. [00:51:25] Grandma’s gonna take care of that one. And I’m like, what a little angel to like be worried about like, okay, we gotta make sure everybody’s taking care of it. I’m gonna coordinate all this because either that’s a reflection of my old man ain’t gonna do it, so I need to, I need to run it down for him. [00:51:40] Somebody [00:51:40] Joe: in this family’s gotta a carrot. I need, I need [00:51:42] OG: to draw this crayon for him because if I don’t, we’re gonna wake up with nothing on Christmas morning. Or maybe, maybe it’s that we’ve done an okay job of like, I. Helping everybody around us recognize that it’s more fun to, you know, have the surprises and, and the other things. [00:51:57] But I got this from you years ago, Joe. We have an event for a bunch of my friends. Um, we don’t do it every year, but, but generally maybe every other year. And it’s, you know, kind of a big event, costs a few bucks, and everybody always asks the same question, well, what do I bring? Like, what, how much? You know, what’s, how much are the tickets? [00:52:12] What, you know, what do you need help with? And I go, no, no, no, I’ll pick a charity. And we usually pick something local here in the Dallas area, and I go, I don’t care what you do, whatever you think you wanna donate in an envelope made out to this place, if you’re gonna bring a check or cash, you’re just putting it in an envelope. [00:52:26] And I’m putting it in a, in an overnight envelope. And then when we’re done at the night, I just tear off the sticker and I mail it, it goes overnight to, to the charity that we picked. And nobody knows. Yeah. I don’t care how much you, you know, I, you could put a dollar in there. I don’t care. It’s gotta be an envelope. [00:52:40] So don’t be a jack wagon and put an empty envelope in there. It doesn’t matter to me what it is. I want you to, I want the experience of us together as a group. More than I want you to pay for some of it, if that makes sense. It’s so fun and whatever you’re able to do, and if it’s a dollar, I’m sure they’re grateful for the dollar ’cause there’s somebody else that’s gonna put, you know, 500 in there. [00:53:00] So I think if you, and I’m not very great at it, if you can spend the majority of your time being thankful for the things that you have around, it’s a lot easier to attract a lot more stuff when you’re not looking for it. You know, if it’s, if you’re just appreciative of the people that are around you and the relationships that you have and the money resources that you have, and the, you know, the stuff that you have right now, magically, some other of those things show up. [00:53:27] You, you get stronger relationships and you get more money and you, you know, are able to impact more lives and that sort of thing. [00:53:33] Joe: Paula, why does generosity feel so good to you? [00:53:36] OG: Hmm. [00:53:37] Paula: There’s a question, you know, with money management of, of, what’s it all for? I talked earlier about waking up to a blaring alarm when it’s freezing temperatures outside. [00:53:47] What’s it really for? Like after the basics are covered, after you have food and shelter and the bottom of the Maslow pyramid is taken care of, there needs to be some type of a reason that you keep showing up to work. And I think that that’s where generosity comes in. And I think it manifests in a lot of ways. [00:54:06] There’s generosity when it comes to, you know, charitable donations. There’s generosity when it comes to mentoring within your career or within your field or industry. You know, there’s generosity just in the way that you interact with clients or with your employees more broadly. Making an impact in some manner, particularly one that you can directly see that ultimately ends up being what it’s all for. [00:54:35] Joe: But I do feel like in what Paul is saying, doc, that there’s a little bit of a paradox here because. You kind of gotta, to use the plain analogy, you gotta put on your own life mask first before you can be generous and help everybody else put on their life mask. [00:54:52] Jordan: Yeah. I mean, I think we do our best and we’re most generous when we feel safe and comfortable and intentional ourselves. [00:55:00] You can give the most to other people. You can form the best interpersonal connections when you feel taken care of, right? We become more generous hopefully, when we have our own sense of financial wealth and wellbeing and feel enough. And so I don’t think they have to be mutually exclusive. In fact, I think one feeds the other. [00:55:16] And so when we feel comfortable and safe within our own environments, whether that’s within money or with that has to do with purpose or whatever it has to do with, that’s when the generosity can come forth much more naturally and do what generosity should do, which is the same thing that purpose should do, is it helps connect us to other people. [00:55:33] And I think that’s what happiness is about, right? It’s, it’s about those connections. [00:55:36] Joe: Let’s stick with you as we find out what everybody’s doing at the place where they live. I heard there might be somebody that has a book coming out on this topic that we might’ve talked about, well, last night in New York [00:55:48] Jordan: City with a bunch of our friends. [00:55:50] So the Purpose Code comes out January 7th. Basically, I described the purpose paradox, why purpose is both super important, as well as the anxiety ridden and what we can do about it. I’m really excited to get it out to the world. Awesome, and people [00:56:04] Joe: can pre-order [00:56:04] Jordan: it. How best way is to go to Jordan grommet.com, J-O-R-D-A-N, at G-R-U-M-E t.com. [00:56:10] You can find links to both my books there as well as the Earn Invest podcast, or just go to Amazon or wherever books are sold. [00:56:17] Joe: Uh, if you’re, uh, walking the Dog or in Your Commute, we’ll have links on our show notes page as we will. To the Afford Anything Show. So the big question, how is Paula Pant wrapping up 2025 on Afford Anything? [00:56:30] What’s coming up? [00:56:32] Paula: Oh, so we have an interview with Cody Sanchez. She’s never heard of her. She’s a very well known for. Encouraging people to acquire businesses, which is, you know, that’s not something that you hear about a lot. You hear a lot of people who have advice about how to start your own business. [00:56:48] But Cody, uh, her expertise is how to acquire businesses and particularly Main Street businesses. So she is on the Afford Anything podcast. We also have Paulina Pompano who has interviewed a bunch of, you know, her, her expertise is talking to really interesting people across a wide variety of domains, learning their stories, and then trying to glean universal truths from this very, like, multidisciplinary dataset. [00:57:16] We talk to her about all of the people that she’s profiled and what she’s learned from all of those stories. [00:57:21] Joe: Yeah, she’s, so, her whole story is interesting too. Her backstory’s very interesting. Yeah, absolutely. Cody Sanchez on The Afford Anything podcast, we’re finer podcast are found, and we’ll link to afford anything on our show notes. [00:57:33] Oh gee, what do you got going on this weekend? The, uh, penultimate weekend before somebody’s birthday. [00:57:39] OG: Uh, well, you know, I was thinking about writing a book, so if you just wanna pre-order my book, uh, just go to, uh, stacky Benjamins dot com. Just, I don’t know, how much is your book, Jordan? 25 bucks. Sounds about right. [00:57:50] Jordan: 27 99. 27. [00:57:52] OG: Nine nine. So ours is gonna be 24 99. So if I can get, uh, roughly 10,000 people to pre-order that, I will write it by June 1st, I promise. Hand to God. So yes, send everything to, uh, PayPal Stacking Benjamins 24 99. [00:58:07] Joe: And the book is called What Chat GPT told me to write. [00:58:12] OG: Oh, no, I wouldn’t do that. I, I mean, if there was 10,000 people that pre-ordered my book, I would put a pretty valiant effort into it because. [00:58:19] That would be, uh, more book sales than Joe. And so therefore I’d have to make mine better than Joe. Whatcha talking about. [00:58:25] Doug: It’s all that matters. Oh. Oh my [00:58:28] OG: god. I don’t know. I actually dunno how many books you sold. You probably sold way, way, way more than that. It’s like, [00:58:32] Joe: it’s like he’s got no data, he’s got no idea. [00:58:35] Uh, that’s, anyways, there’s [00:58:36] OG: nothing going on. We’ve, we actually have, uh, football banquet this weekend for my, both my boys, you know, the school does, uh, well the parents actually put on like a end of the season banquet. So nice. All the awards and you know, that kind of deal for the team and, and it was a really great season for the kids and happy to be a part of it and happy to watch ’em be successful and celebrate ’em. [00:58:55] Joe: Last two questions then, Paula, what, uh, field you working in after we’re done recording? [00:59:01] Paula: Yeah, I, I gotta go plow, gotta go, uh, harvest. I gotta what? Yeah. Well I guess it’s December, so there wouldn’t actually be a whole lot of outdoor work. [00:59:09] Joe: No. That’s why you can be here with us, [00:59:10] Paula: right? [00:59:11] Joe: Yes. And then, uh, Doug, what’s for dinner at your house tonight? [00:59:14] Cod Pod Tuna. And Doug, you’ve got the last question. What are the three big things we should remember from today’s episode? [00:59:23] Doug: Well, Joe, here’s what’s stacked up on our to-do list for today. First, take some advice from the future, star of the Simple Life with Nicole Ritchie and Paula Pants. Paula, take that piece of straw outta your teeth and give us more of that Honest [00:59:35] Paula: to goodness down home advice. [00:59:36] Uh, I would say never forget what it’s all for. There’s gotta be a reason that you wake up to a blaring alarm. [00:59:45] Doug: And second, remember that really thought provoking thing? OG said, og. Hit us with that again. [00:59:51] OG: Instead of having a party where everybody has to pay to come to your party, just collect money. And then if you feel like it, give it to charity. [00:59:59] Doug: You got options. But the big lesson, don’t tell your mom that Francis Drake should have been a rapper. ’cause she’ll just tell you she already has all his albums. I think that woman needs a hearing aid. I. Thanks to Paula Apa for hanging out with us today. You’ll find her fabulous podcast, afford anything wherever you listen to finer podcasts. [01:00:20] Thanks also to Jordan Grommet, AKA Doc G for joining us today. You’ll find his latest book, the Purpose Code, how to Unlock Meaning, maximize Happiness, and Cook the Perfect Meatloaf wherever you Buy books. Thanks also to OG for joining us. Looking for good financial help. Head to Stacking Benjamins dot com slash OG for his calendar. [01:00:42] This show is the property of SB Podcasts llc, copyright 2024, and is created by Joe Saul Sea High. Joe gets help from a few of our neighborhood friends. You’ll find out about our awesome team at Stacking Benjamins dot com, along with the show notes and how you can find us on YouTube and all the usual social media spots. [01:01:03] Come say hello. Oh yeah, and before I go, not only should you not take advice from these nerds. Don’t take advice from people you don’t know. This show is for entertainment purposes only. Before making any financial decisions, speak with a real financial advisor. I’m Joe’s Mom’s neighbor, Duggan. We’ll see you next time back here at the Stacking Benjamin Show.
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