Jannese Torres is a force of nature. She purposefully quit her high-paying job as an engineer because it didn’t fit her personality AFTER posting about it on social media. Today she joins us to talk about living your life intentionally, building financial reserves, demanding more from your boss, and if you get “no” as your answer, moving on. As the host of Yo Quiero Dinero and a woman who’s a social media/blogging powerhouse, she’s used to talking about life as it is, without mincing words. Today you get the full Janesse as she shares how to negotiate, build savings, and more.
Plus, in our headline, new legislation should help you find advisors who are trustworthy when it comes to working with your retirement plan money. Will the reality equal the promise? We weigh in on how the legislation works, what we think will happen, and how to plan whether it finally becomes law in September or not. You’ll be ready to find better help for your retirement after today’s show.
Plus we answer a call from Jen, who wonders about HSA plans. Can she move money from her IRA to an HSA? And that’s not all….of course, Doug shares some trivia you’ll be sharing later with friends and family.
On the back porch, we talk about what we’ve decided for our Friday roundtable shows. Who’s going to be the new frequent contributor?
Of course, that’s just the FIRST episode of our new eight weeks! We’ve got action packed mentorship from Brian Preston, Robert Niles, humor from Lisa Curry, great feedback from a panel of kids-and-money experts, and more!
Deeper dives with curated links, topics, and discussions are in our newsletter, The 201, available at https://www.stackingbenjamins.com/201
Enjoy!
Our Headlines
- Advisers on Trillions in IRAs Must Now Put Your Interest First (Wall Street Journal)
Jannese Torres
Big thanks to Jannese Torres for joining us today. To learn more about Jannese, visit Yo Quiero Dinero. Grab yourself a copy of the book Financially Lit!.
Watch on our YouTube channel:
Doug’s Trivia
- What is the most watched sitcom finale of all time?
Better call Saul…Sehy & OG
- Stacker Jen called in with a question about rolling over a traditional IRA to an HSA.
Have a question for the show?
Want more than just the show notes? How about our newsletter with STACKS of related, deeper links?
- Check out The 201, our email that comes with every Monday and Wednesday episode, PLUS a list of more than 19 of the top money lessons Joe’s learned over his own life about money. From credit to cash reserves, and insurance to investing, we’ll tackle all of these. Head to StackingBenjamins.com/the201 to sign up (it’s free and we will never give away your email to others).
Other Mentions
Join Us Wednesday
Tune in on Wednesday when we discuss how much money will you need for retirement? We’ll break down how much you need and how to get saving for it.
Written by: Kevin Bailey
Miss our last show? Listen here: What Life Lessons Would You Share With A Younger You? GREATEST HITS WEEK (SB1513).
Episode transcript
[00:00:00] Joe: It is Monday. And, uh, you know what that means? Two things. Uh, like the last several Mondays in a row, I am sick. That’s number one. Number two is we are lifting our mugs, not just your faces. Young men. We’re lifting our mugs to salute our troops. There we go. Doug’s got nothing. You got nothing. You show up in a recording with nothing. [00:00:22] Yeah, because whatcha doing side of the basement. Every Monday we take one side, we take one week off. One week off. And look at you. Oh, yeah. I forgot. [00:00:31] Doug: My side of the basement is on Eastern time, Joe. And so I’ve been done with my coffee for hours. [00:00:37] Joe: Oh, we, you couldn’t save a cup og. Not for us, not for. This is what the Stacking, Benjamins stacker community means to Doug. [00:00:46] Raise your glass. On behalf of OG and I and all the men and women at Stacking Benjamins Baking Podcast in mom’s basement except Doug and the, uh, men and women at Navy Federal Credit Union, here’s to our troops. Let’s go stack some s together now. And Hu Yeah, there we go. [00:01:10] Doug: Live from Joe’s mom’s basement. It’s the Stacking Benjamin Show. [00:01:25] I’m Joe’s mom’s neighbor, Doug. Today you’ll learn how to level up your finances and increase your money power. With author and the host of Yo Kiro Dero, Janice Torres. In our headlines, new rules are coming around advisors and your retirement funds. Now advisors have some guardrails around the advice they can give. [00:01:45] What’s changed? We’ll share plus we’ll answer a question from one stacker who thought, you know, I better call Saul. See hi and og. And then I’ll share some friendly trivia. And now two guys who will be there for you. Win the rain. Do I have to finish this joke? Do I have to say it like that? Yes. Okay, fine. [00:02:06] God be there for you when the rain starts to pour like they’ve been there. Be for, I told you this was gonna suck. [00:02:14] Speaker 3: There [00:02:14] Doug: you go. It’s Joe and O Jean. [00:02:23] Joe: What a great way to start. Eight weeks with Doug serenading us. Hey everybody. Welcome back to the Stacking Benjamin Show, the Greatest Money Show on Earth. We’re super happy you’re here with us. We’ve got just a great lineup this eight weeks. We’re so happy. So relax. Sit back and get ready for eight weeks of money. [00:02:43] Fun. Featuring the guy across the cart table from me. Mr. og. How are you man? You’ve been out in Aggie land lately. [00:02:49] OG: Hmm indeed. Gig him as they say. [00:02:51] Joe: Our friend, Mr. Fier, uh, Paul Lambert will, will be happy to hear that you’ve been out there looking at that campus. He’ll probably start a scholarship on behalf of, uh, the Firelight podcast. [00:03:04] OG: Pretty God, we need all the help we can get. [00:03:06] Joe: Yes. And I know Paul’s, uh, backing away from the subscribe button right now going, I don’t know who you are. I don’t know anything. Uh, what’s up with you, man? What’d you do on your week off? [00:03:15] OG: You know, my kid’s a junior. The oldest is a junior, so we’re doing some college tours and, uh, she talked about, we went down to Texas a and m last week and, and got the, the full Monty as they call it. [00:03:25] I don’t know if that means the same down there as it does other places might mean something [00:03:28] Joe: different. Slightly. We [00:03:29] OG: got the, got the whole thing, the whole shebang as it were. Yeah. So school’s almost over for the kids. So we’re, we’re getting ready for, we’re getting ready for summer. [00:03:38] Joe: Well, speaking of the whole shebang, we got the whole shebang. [00:03:40] This eight weeks, as I mentioned, Janice Torres gonna kick it off today. She is the award-winning host of the award-winning, uh, Dusti, how many times I can say award-winning in a single sentence. Three Yo Chiro De Niro podcast. And Janice is, uh, just been amazing every time she’s been on our show. Can’t wait to have her back today to help us get excited and get moving on our money. [00:04:04] But before that, we’ve got some interesting legislation that just happened og, but even before that, we need this podcast to be free so that you guys are able to have, uh, as much stacky Benjamin’s goodness as possible. So hang out with us for just a couple minutes, or we highlight a couple sponsors that pay for the show so you don’t have to. [00:04:25] Janice Torres waiting in the wing. So let’s get moving. [00:04:29] Speaker 3: Hello doling. And now it’s time for your favorite part of the show, our Stacking Benjamins headlines. [00:04:35] Joe: Our headline today comes to us from the Wall Street Journal and is written by Anne Terin and has some news OG that I’m sure you heard about, but a lot of our stackers have not. [00:04:48] Americans will get new protections for the trillions of dollars that moved outta their 4 0 1 Ks and into individual retirement accounts under the Labor Department’s regulations released just a couple weeks ago. Savers moved close to a trillion dollars each year outta their 401k employer sponsored plans into IRAs. [00:05:08] That number’s grown as more people retire, change jobs, and while 401k plans have strict rules. Regarding any financial advice to be in the best interest of savers, IRA plans do not have those same rules until now. And it turns out, og, that the new regulation says that there is a new fiduciary requirement for IRAs that companies have to put into place by September. [00:05:34] What do you think about the new rules? This a, this a good thing? [00:05:37] OG: Well, I think just like the ERISA rules a couple of years ago from the Department of Labor, this will be challenged many, many times over in court and the court challenges will prevail. So this will become a big giant nothing burger. So frustrating. [00:05:52] Well, I mean, yes and no at the end of the day. What they need to do is instead of trying to tie the products, and this is the problem, is that the government keeps on like trying to grab onto little bits and pieces of product, right? And say like, oh, well 4 0 1 Ks need to be in the best interest of client. [00:06:08] Oh, IRAs now need, how about annuities? How about why don’t they just make the people who give advice do it? That would just be the easiest solution. Then it doesn’t matter what the product is. You don’t have to say, well, this product isn’t technical. ’cause listen, this is what’s gonna happen. People who don’t want to play by the rules are gonna figure out a way around this. [00:06:26] They’re just gonna be, you know, they’ll just say, oh, well, you know, this isn’t considered that, or this isn’t considered. Just say, if you give financial advice, you have to do it in the best interest of your client. Period. Full stop, end of sentence. It doesn’t require a bunch of, you know, a thousand pages of, of legislation to get it done. [00:06:43] The good news is that a lot of organizations already have that CFP board, right? If you’re a certified financial planner. In order to be a CFP, you have to, regardless of who you work for, what product you provide, you know, any of those sorts of things, you have to, uh, stick to a fiduciary rule. If you’re work for a registered investment advisory firm, you know, like a fee only firm or fee-based firm, that at the federal level and, and most state levels are required to be in the, uh, work in the best interest of the clients. [00:07:11] Really the biggest issue is around being a stockbroker or an insurance salesperson. And that doesn’t mean that you can, cannot be those people and not still work in the best interest of your client. It’s just that little angle, that little section of the, of the world is still operating under, you know, the, the old school, 1970, 1980s broker mentality, and we’ve seen those movies, right? [00:07:35] Wolf of Wall Street, or, you know, or just Wall Street. The whole idea of being a stockbroker, it doesn’t exist anymore. I. So why do we have still have rules from 50 years ago? It’s just, it’s beyond me. [00:07:48] Joe: Anne writes that proponents of extending the fiduciary rule to IRAs contend many savers aren’t fluent in finance, don’t necessarily understand the incentives and the potential conflicts of interest different types of advisors have when pushing particular products. [00:08:02] And then she writes, by the way, to your point, OG insurance agents, for example, can earn hefty commissions for selling annuities. Like she goes, right ads. Look, there’s nothing wrong with [00:08:10] OG: earning a commission. There’s nothing wrong with getting paid and there’s nothing wrong with getting paid 15%. Just freaking tell people that that’s what’s happening. [00:08:19] And guess what? That will sort of help facilitate the transaction, right? Like if you’re, if you go to buy a car and the car guy goes, look, if you buy the Buick, it’s 10 grand. I get a 15% commission on that. If you buy the Cadillac, I get a 2% commission. Both cars are $10,000. You will self-select as an investor which car to buy. [00:08:44] Right. And just be like, well, if they’re both the same, this one’s gonna save me a little bit more money in the long run. I, I just don’t understand why, why we can’t have the rules and regulations around the people in. The more we try to tie to products, the more that those industries who have boat loads of cash associated with trying to prevent governor, government officials from pa you know, we’ve all seen the, uh, the memes about, you know, the Congress people and their stock trading and how they like Yeah. [00:09:13] You know, average 280% a year returns, you know? Yeah. Why do you think that is? How do you think that that works? Because it, that’s, you know, that’s just how the, it’s how it works. So get those people out of the decision making. Just be like reregulate people now in hot product. Oh, crap. Now the insurance product manufacturers don’t have a leg to stand on. [00:09:33] I, it’s done. It’s just crazy. Call me crazy. [00:09:36] Joe: It’s funny that you bring up the car dealer. I remember when I went to buy my, uh, last car that I paid cash for, the dealer didn’t realize that I was paying cash for a car. By the way, it was five grand for this car. So you can tell what, what type of a great car it was. [00:09:52] And the guy goes, okay, well we just need your, we just need your social security number. And, uh, and we’ll run the credit check. I’m like, whoa, I don’t need a credit check. The guy’s like, oh yeah, uh, uh, uh, you have to do the credit check. I’m like, why do I need to do credit check if I’m handing you cash? And the guy goes, oh, because, uh, because it’s standard. [00:10:11] It’s what we do. I’m like, why is it standard? And he goes, you know, I’m gonna go talk to my manager. Then he goes back and talks to the manager and I didn’t even, you know, I knew this at the time, but it was really frustrating that, uh, the dude didn’t wanna tell me, OG, we get a commission if you apply for a loan through our place, and we make as much money on that commission as we do on selling the car. [00:10:34] So, [00:10:34] OG: well, probably more as a matter of fact, [00:10:36] Joe: yeah. I’m not as interested in selling you a car as I am on selling you a loan. Selling [00:10:40] OG: you a loan. Yeah. [00:10:41] Joe: And by the way, just tell me that, just tell me that upfront and it would’ve been, well, [00:10:46] OG: I I, I’ve told lots of stories over the years about this exact same thing. [00:10:50] My favorite one was we could get a 60 month loan on the car for 0% or a 72 month loan for 2.9. And the finance person looking straight across the table from me saying the 72 month loan is a better deal because it costs less. [00:11:07] Joe: Oh. Because it costs [00:11:09] OG: less. It can’t possibly cost less. It has interest attached to it. [00:11:15] How, [00:11:16] Doug: what school did you go to? That would’ve been great to just force them to get out paper and pencil and prove the math to you. I [00:11:22] OG: did. That’s awesome. I did. I was like, look, gimme your calculator. You are no longer allowed to have it. Walk me through this. [00:11:29] Joe: I’m gonna disarm you. You wouldn’t happen to be a. [00:11:31] Texas a and m grad, would you? ’cause my kid can’t go to that [00:11:34] OG: school if sing. Ooh. I probably was a Michigan State grad, honestly. All things considered. [00:11:40] Doug: Alright, let’s talk to our listeners about why disclosure of. Commissions on some financial products is something that we feel like should be regulated and should be sort of forced versus on any other, I’ll say, consumer product, whether it’s a car or anything else, because I don’t know that I really want those people to be forced to tell me how much they’re making on my car loan. [00:12:06] Like I, I don’t know that I wanna be in a place where everybody who gets commissions on any product is forced to have to tell me, well, it isn’t about, I’m telling you this because I get more money on, on my paycheck. [00:12:17] Joe: It isn’t about how much money they make. It’s about harm to the consumer. And so when it comes to your money, the more money that gets taken from you, the harder it is it’s going to be for you to make that money back. [00:12:30] So I consider this to be very similar to the smoking thing, right? They’re not telling you about how much money they make, they’re telling you about how harmful this product is. [00:12:39] OG: I think it’s, back to your point, Doug, when it comes to money stuff, we do disclose it. When you go buy a car loan, it does say this is how many payments you’re gonna make and this is how much it’s gonna cost you. [00:12:48] We [00:12:48] Doug: do for credit card interest as well now, but we don’t have to know how much the sales guy made on that, on that purchase. [00:12:55] OG: No, but it’s not about, because we’re talking about the money side of it. The money side of it needs to be disclosed and to, to your point and to Joe’s, when the money part of it impacts my part of it, I should get to know how that’s affecting me. [00:13:09] If it’s a choice between these two products that are virtually identical and one one of these products has a built-in sales charge associated with it, and one of these products does not. Then by the disclosure of that, the consumer will basically eliminate the unfavorable choice. It’s the fact that they don’t know, Hey, I’ve got two annuities. [00:13:32] I think both of these annuities will work for me. Which one should I pick? And the person who’s the better salesperson wins, not the person who has the better product. It’s literally the better salesperson at that point. And that better salesperson could be earning a lot of extra money that could be staying in the pocket for me. [00:13:53] How do you think the commissions are paid? It’s paid by the, it’s not benevolence. It’s paid by the cost of the product. So if those numbers are transparent, and as a consumer, I get to decide ipso facto, I’m gonna decide on the most valuable piece, whether that’s a high or low number. Then the cost structure to me, the consumer is going to, I. [00:14:16] That improve. [00:14:17] Doug: There’s 64 different components that go into the cost of a product, whether it’s a car or it’s a financial piece. Sure. Do we wanna force all of those elements that aren’t purely associated with the car, but just to use an easy, tangible example, do we wanna force all of those things to be, if it’s two $5,000 cars. [00:14:42] That car has utility value to me. Whether it’s because I like the color better or because I think this one’s gonna last longer and stay on the road longer, whatever the reason is. But the, the salesperson makes an extra commission on this one over here, and it, and it happens to not be the one I like. [00:14:57] It’s on me to figure out which one is better suited to me. A hundred percent. [00:15:01] OG: Yeah. It is on you. Absolutely. So you’re making a decision with all the facts, [00:15:05] Doug: but no, I’m saying I might not know all the facts. I might not know how much that salesperson’s commission is on that car. I don’t know why I need somebody to force line item disclosures of all of these elements. [00:15:18] ’cause I think that, I think that’s a slippery slope. I don’t, I don’t know if I, I love that I was expecting you guys to say, well, here’s why financial products are different. Here’s why we need to have that regulation on, on disclosure for commissions in financial products. That’s different for these other products. [00:15:36] Which I’m, I might be totally down for. I just don’t love it on like everything that involves a sales commission. [00:15:42] OG: I think that you’re right, it is a slippery slope in terms of the disclosure of all the different things. You don’t want GM to say, here’s your new car, and by the way, the bolts cost 52 cents a piece. [00:15:51] The tires were $587. We have a margin in here of 11% that goes to us as profit. You know, oh wait, wait, how come you get 11% profit? How you know 5% pro, you know, they can get a little slippery, which for me is I think why it needs to stop being on the product level. It needs to be on the person level. If you just said, everybody who gives financial advice needs to provide advice in the best interest of their client, then that solves all of these other problems. [00:16:17] Instead of, you know, the Department of Labor going, oh, uh, 4 0 1 Ks need to have this. And if you’re an advisor, then you have to follow all these rules around 4 0 1 Ks. Oh, now ERISA comes in and goes, you know, ah, if, if you’re an advisor to follow these rules, because we wanna, we also wanna regulate IRAs. [00:16:35] It’s like, well, what about brokerage accounts? How can, we can’t regulate brokerage accounts? What about five 20 nines and custodial accounts and bank accounts, and all these other sorts of places where you have your money? Why do I get to manipulate the outta that as a shady person? But these other pro, it’s because it’s, it’s not the product, it’s the person. [00:16:53] It’s the person. So just, just say, everyone who gives financial advice has to do it in the best interest of their consumer. Yeah. They’re a commission based. [00:17:01] Joe: Stock brokers I’d send mom to, they’re a commission based stock brokers. I would never do that. There are insurance agents I’d send mom to. There’s insurance agents. [00:17:09] I wouldn’t send mom to. It is clearly a person by person thing. The incentive, which is what the government’s chasing, just makes it easier for people to slide down the wrong side of the slope. But I, but I’m, I’m a hundred percent in agreement. People are asking what the actionable piece of this is. I think, I think the actual piece of this, so g is, is that while we can wait and wait on the regulation and go, man, it should be, this is what should be. [00:17:33] I think now we know some of the questions to ask, which one gives you a bigger incentive for me to do? How much is that financial incentive? What’s the downside to you if I don’t, if I don’t take this advice? I think asking some of those questions could go a long way. ’cause watching those car dealers squirm, luckily it was only a $5,000 transaction, showed me really quickly that these guys were hugely compensated to sell me this loan versus, uh, sell me a $5,000 car. [00:18:03] We will continue this discussion in our newsletter, the 2 0 1, diving into the definition of fiduciary. How does the fiduciary work? So for people with even more basic, fundamental questions about this whole fiduciary argument, and then how do I work around it? If the government isn’t going to protect me, what do I do to protect myself? [00:18:23] Well, we got you covered, uh, stack of Benjamins dot com slash 2 0 1. Always free our 2 0 1 newsletter as one of the highest open rates in the, uh, in the industry whenever we’re talking to people. And we tell them how many people read our, our 2 0 1. It’s a, I’m, I’m very proud of the work that, uh, Kevin and the team do, uh, on that newsletter on Tuesdays and Thursdays. [00:18:43] Next up, the most inspiring part of today’s podcast. Today’s mentor, Janice Torres joining us. She is the host of the Yo Kiro Dero Podcast, and also she is a woman that’s helped millions of people get their money together. Currently calls, uh, Puerto Rico home, one of my favorite places on earth. But today she’s in mom’s basement talking about how you can get rolling on your money. [00:19:06] It’s a great way to kick off eight weeks of brand new shows for you. But before that, every. Monday, Wednesday, Friday. If you’re new to this podcast, we have a trivia question from Doug. Usually based on something happening in history or maybe it’s uh, something to do with the definition. What do we got today, Doug? [00:19:25] Doug: Yeah. First of all, I gotta say it’s so uncool, Joe. You do this all the time. You give this lead in. That makes me get all excited and proud of what I do. Like, hey, it’s time for today. The most inspiring part of this show, and everybody, not just me, I’m sure all of our listeners is expecting you to say Doug’s trivia and then you go on to say something about a great guest we have or something. [00:19:46] But we just once can you finish that sentence with Doug’s trivia, the two most, uh, inspiring pieces of the show [00:19:51] Joe: coming up next? Okay. I’ll take it. Jimmy Bifurcation with a bullet and then, uh, slightly way down below. Doug. [00:20:00] Doug: Hey there, stackers. I’m Joe’s mom’s neighbor, Doug, feeling pretty good about that intro. [00:20:05] On this date of, in 2004, the series finale of Friends aired on NBC. After 10 smash hit seasons. You realize. Do, do you realize people born that year are 19 now? God, I hope they’re listening. I hope they’re listening to us right now. They’re 19 years old. Wow. Yeah. Just fresh faced and enthusiastic about life. [00:20:27] Listening to us, figuring out how they’re gonna be millionaires by the time they’re like 25. Oh gee, you were what, four? When friends came out then? [00:20:34] OG: Uh uh. It just barely. Okay, here we go. Barely. [00:20:37] Doug: I was about to tell the story that your mom and I almost, oh, hey. Were on a popular sitcom one time. Oh, okay. I dunno if you remember Joe, but they were shooting the reboot of Dallas here in Texarkana, and they needed extras for a big wedding scene. [00:20:50] That’s right. For some convincing. But I got your mom to go with me as my date. Oh, settle down. As actors, we were. Gonna go as actors. They had us way in the background for the first few takes, and I could tell after a while that the scene needed someone with great dance moves. So on the next take, kicked off my shoes, slid out to the center of the dance floor like Tom Cruise and Risky business. [00:21:12] And as soon as the director saw how much better of a dancer I was and the guy they had play in the groom, dude was a doofus. The director just called cut like right then and there sends me home. In hindsight, I should’ve owned better than to upstage the main character, but as a sign of respect, they had security walk me to my car so I wouldn’t get mobbed by all the single women on the way out. [00:21:33] That’s nice. Yeah. Looks nice of a, Hey, here’s today’s trivia question. What is the most watched sitcom finale of all time? I’ll be back right after I get my profile reposted on central casting. That must have been some sort of technical problem or something. [00:21:57] Hey there, stackers. I’m Method Actor and Wouldbe sitcom star Joe’s mom’s neighbor Doug. Part of what drew me to background acting in the first place was the story of the actor who played the barista Gunther on Friends Hollywood Legend has it that he was the only extra on set who knew how to work an espresso machine, so they gave him a more prominent placement, which later turned into a recurring role. [00:22:21] Today’s trivia question is, what is the most watched sitcom finale of all time? The answer, although the series finale of Friends drew an impressive 52 and a half million viewers, the most watched sitcom series finale of all time goes to the legendary show Mash that pulled in nearly 106 million viewers, or you know, 212 million eyeballs. [00:22:44] Give or take, and now here to help us increase. Did you get it? Figure it out. Remind me. Remind you of your shop teacher in ninth grade. Oh, God, no. No, no. And now here to help us increase our dero, it’s today’s mentor, Janice Torres, [00:23:06] Joe: and we’re super happy. She’s back at the card table in mom’s basement and color coordinated. [00:23:11] We got the same outfit on Janice Torres this year. [00:23:13] Jannese: How are you? I’m so good. Thank you for having me back, Joe. It’s always a blast being on the show. I was so excited [00:23:20] Joe: that you have this new project out. But okay. Before we get to that, in the introduction to your book, you talk about how when you go to a new city. [00:23:27] You are the friend that like looks up all the food options and I know with your food blog and all the food stuff you’ve done that uh, you would of course be that person, but I’m that person in my friend group, but you do it better than me. So we’ll get to financially LA here in a second, but tell me, you talk about how you do research when you go to a new city and look up the cool places to eat the cool food options, what do you use? [00:23:52] Because I’m envisioning you don’t go to like the usual Yelp and TripAdvisor, I don’t think. [00:23:56] Jannese: No, I do a quick Google search. I mean, honestly, I feel like Google has all the answers that we need and so I like doing a review of, I need ratings. I need ratings to be at least like four and a half stars or I won’t even look at them. [00:24:08] And I have this thing about restaurants. If you don’t have an actual website, it’s very suspicious to me and I just usually will not go, like if you just have a Facebook page or an Instagram, that’s not enough for me to go to a restaurant. I wanna see a full fledged blog website. And I think that’s just the blogger in me being real snooty about it. [00:24:28] Yeah, but wait a minute. Don’t you live in Puerto Rico? No, I live in Florida, but I go back and forth to Puerto Rico a lot. But you’re, [00:24:34] Joe: you’re in Puerto Rico a lot because, you know, some of the most kickass places in Puerto Rico are those places that don’t have a website. They don’t have crap. Like, you walk in and you’re like, I think somebody might have died in that corner. [00:24:45] And the food is amazing. [00:24:47] Jannese: Yes, there is the exception for Puerto Rico. You must go to every roadside stand that just looks very, very sketchy. And that’s where the best food is. [00:24:56] Joe: When I go there next time, you and I gotta go together ’cause I, I want us to go up the pork highway together. [00:25:01] Jannese: Oh my gosh. I’m so glad that you know about this. [00:25:03] This means that you’re actually getting out of the capital, which is the most important thing you have to do when you get to Puerto Rico. It’s heaven, Janice. And when we went, [00:25:11] Joe: Cheryl, my spouse was like, there was a place about halfway up this highway. But by the way, for people that don’t know, it’s this road up a mountain and there is a different food stand every corner. [00:25:23] Yes. With almost no place to park. And when you get there, there’s somebody with a machete and there is a pig on a spit and they literally chop it up. They hand you the best pork you’ve ever had with rice and with just fantastic food and a cold beer and uh, and it’s amazing. But Cheryl wanted to go to this one place, Janice, because they had salsa dancing. [00:25:46] Oh. And she’s like, we are finally gonna learn how to salsa dance. And so we get our pork, we sit down at this table, we watch the people salsa dancing. And Cheryl goes, we’re not gonna salsa dance [00:25:58] Jannese: because these people could be on dancing with the Stars. Janice. It’s true. Those are my parents too. You probably saw them on the dance floor ’cause they are pretty epic in their own right. [00:26:06] It’s, I’m not worthy. I am not worthy. I mean, you did try to like do the advanced level dancing. I would definitely recommend starting with maybe some meringue, just some side to side action. ’cause salsa definitely for the next level. [00:26:20] Joe: It totally, but I gotta tell you, it was worth being there. ’cause I saw some stuff, some beautiful dancing. [00:26:26] That was amazing. All right. When did your parents, by the way, leave Puerto Rico [00:26:29] Jannese: in the 1980s? So my dad is a military veteran. He joined the Navy. The Navy was the ticket out of the island, and they got married, lived in Virginia Beach for a couple years, and then I was born in New Jersey. And you [00:26:43] Joe: decided that you wanted to be an engineer? [00:26:45] How come? [00:26:46] Jannese: Well, I don’t know if I decided or I was kind of just like given the suggestion subconsciously by my dad. I saw him make a lot of money as an engineer. So he was working on computers since, you know, they were the size of rooms. Okay. So he was working on, on the Navy ship on computers and he saw the whole like internet boom and all that stuff happen. [00:27:10] So I think as a kid I just associated engineering with making a lot of money. I. And as a Latina and I, I hear this a lot from people that I talk to. We get three job options. It’s doctor, lawyer, engineer, and so I knew, I like arguing. You know, I, I will be down for a great conversation, but I didn’t wanna become a lawyer. [00:27:31] Medical school was on my horizon, as you might know from my background. I have degrees in molecular biology, chemistry, and such, but things got derailed and I ended up using my science degree to become an engineer, which was great. Like lucrative, you know, I made money. I got into really cool companies, but it was also just not the thing that I wanted to do. [00:27:54] And so there was side sort of a reconciliation of like my life decisions that led me down the path to now talking about money and writing a book and entrepreneurship and all the things. [00:28:04] Joe: Well, and this is a big aha from financially lip, because I think there’s a bunch of our stackers in our community, they think that they’re after money, they listen to shows like your show and my show because of the fact that, you know what? [00:28:15] I need more money. I want more money. And you had like this gigantic aha, I’m making $75,000 a year. I’m in my twenties. I’ve got this job that people would kill for, and yet the money wasn’t the thing. [00:28:28] Jannese: Yeah, I think it’s uh, kind of coming to the realization that you’re misaligned with your priorities in life. [00:28:34] A lot of us can operate sort of an autopilot where we just are trying to check off the boxes of things we’ve been told are success, like the degree, like buying the house, like getting married. And I don’t think there’s enough self-reflection that happens. Before those decisions are made. I know for me, when I was thinking about kind of restarting my career, before I became a food blogger and a personal finance podcaster, I wanted to go back to culinary school. [00:29:00] Like I just wanted to skip this engineering phase in my life. I said, okay, I did that, got the two degrees. But then there was all these thoughts about, well, I’m gonna get into debt again and then I’m not gonna make as much money. Because now I was used to the lifestyle that, you know, earning six figures was getting me. [00:29:17] There was a lot of mind drama that was going on with just giving myself permission to shed the identity and to try something new. And I think a lot of people don’t know what to do with that. [00:29:26] Joe: I was trying to put myself in your shoes as I was reading. And I’m thinking that I’m in this job that I hate. [00:29:32] I’m making a lot of money and I have to feel like this misalignment. And you go a lot into trauma. A lot into trauma. And people dealing with their financial past lives, not even just for you, but the family that you’re brought up in. The things that happen around you. You’re at this job you’re going into that you hate every day. [00:29:49] There’s gotta be this feeling of guilt, Janice. Like just this, I effed it all up. [00:29:54] Jannese: Yeah. And I think there’s also the sense of guilt of wanting to make all my parents’ sacrifices worth it too. You know, as someone who is the eldest daughter who’s had all the American dreams pushed on me, uh, not necessarily like, you know, purposefully, right? [00:30:10] But you know, you for sure you want your parents’ sacrifice of leaving their homeland and giving this opportunity to mean something. And there was a lot of these feelings of shame and guilt for not wanting what they wanted for me and then wondering if that was gonna affect our relationship when I finally decided like, I don’t wanna do this anymore. [00:30:29] Joe: You write that, uh, you’d walk into work 30 minutes late every day on purpose, hoping they get sick of you and fire you right then and there. And then you write, beware. Would you manifest? Because [00:30:41] Jannese: it could. It could happen. Yes, and it did happen. So that layoff, I think, was one of the first realizations for me that I needed to be my own biggest advocate. [00:30:54] I needed to be my own financial support system. The corporate job situation was always sold to me by everyone around me. I was like, this is the safe thing that you do. You know, if you want to take risks, if you want to be struggling to pay your bills, you become an entrepreneur. Which is ironic because I think entrepreneurship, for me as a kid, it was seen as something you did because you didn’t have any other options. [00:31:17] You had legal issues, you had immigration status issues. You were just unemployable. And being on the other side of it, it’s like. Wait, that’s a completely skewed narrative that we’re placing on this potential path that can give you way more access to wealth than, you know, a nine to five paycheck can. [00:31:35] Joe: Well, I feel like, I don’t, I don’t remember who it was that said this, but somebody said once there’s two doors, there’s security and there is opportunity, and whoever chooses the security door gets neither. Mm. That’s good. That’s really good it though. I know it’s so tough for people, but it’s funny, I again tried to put myself in your shoes. [00:31:56] I remember getting fired from this job and it was a huge low point for me. But you like immediately, I feel like Janice’s flower just begins to blossom. Then you’re like skipping away from this job with your severance check and hand going, I can finally now be me. [00:32:13] Jannese: Yeah. You know, it’s funny because I think that’s a trauma response. [00:32:16] Honestly. I’ve done a lot of self-reflection on like how I handle stress and like unexpected life moments, and I’m a fixer. I am a problem solver. I’m not one to like sit there and wallow and live in victim land. I’m like, we need to figure this shit out. I need to figure out what I’m gonna do. And so that severance check represented this runway, if you will, to just be able to explore my food blog that I had started about six months before getting laid off. [00:32:42] I didn’t wanna rush back into a job. I wanted to test the waters of entrepreneurship and knowing that I had this extra money, I was already living below my means. I had an emergency fund and I was able to get unemployment as well. I said, I. This is what I’ve been waiting for. So why am I gonna rush back to get another job that I’m probably gonna hate? [00:33:01] Uh, let me take this opportunity to really explore this thing that I started as a hobby and see if I can turn it into a business. [00:33:07] Joe: Well, and that’s a great transition because this leads to then financial self-care. Like I’ve gotta take care of me and this alignment between who I am, what I do, and my money. [00:33:18] And you pivot right then from this into emergency funds. I’m like, what a pivot from this big picture into emergency funds. So why is putting your own mask on first and financial alignment, why does that start with, you know, we think about emergency fund, Janice is this little tiny thing, right? Mm-Hmm. But the placement that you have an emergency fund is, it’s a big effing deal. [00:33:40] Yeah, it’s a big deal. How come? [00:33:42] Jannese: Well, I think when you know that you can handle whatever life has to throw at you, you walk around with a different sense of energy. You know, like an emergency doesn’t just have to be your car breaking down. It can be finding yourself in an abusive relationship. It can be finding yourself in a toxic work environment that is affecting your mental health. [00:34:04] But when you know that you have the financial means to escape those situations, you’re just a more powerful person and you can really make decisions that are aligned with what type of life you wanna live versus being subject to the environment around you. And I think that’s why it’s so powerful to put yourself first in that way, because it really does give you options [00:34:24] Joe: as you build wealth. [00:34:25] You consistently have other people asking you for money, asking you to help them. And you caution people here too. I know that we talked to Gigi Gonzalez a few months ago and she was talking about how in her family. Hey man, my cousin was gonna ask me for money about, for the concierge, and it doesn’t matter if you have money or not, you are gonna give money in her family. [00:34:47] Like how do you draw these barriers when it comes to the people around you and making sure that you take care of yourself first? [00:34:54] Jannese: Yeah. I love this question and this is something that a lot of folks are dealing with. So I like kind of taking a two-pronged approach. First, it’s putting some boundaries around what type of support you can give. [00:35:05] And so in the book I talk about this concept of a family emergency fund so that you can actually earmark specific money to. Family. You know when things do come up. I had never heard of this before, by the way. Shout I’ve been doing this for to my CFP 30 years. [00:35:19] Joe: She amazing. [00:35:20] Jannese: Yeah. This is the benefit of working with professionals and having them assess your financial situation. [00:35:25] My CFP said, okay, you wanna help your family? That’s great. I love that idea. Why don’t we set up a family emergency fund and you can earmark funds for them so that way whenever there’s something that happens, you’re not dipping into your own savings or investments, you already have money set aside. I was like, oh my God, it’s like a sinking fund for your family. [00:35:43] Why didn’t anyone tell me this is a thing? So that’s number one, right? And then I think it’s also important to understand what giving actually looks like. Like please don’t give people loans because if somebody’s asking you for money, chances are they cannot pay it back. So you have to be okay with just giving for the sake of giving because you can, and not letting that be the thing that ruins your relationship because you have these unrealistic expectations about what people can give back once you’ve, you know, extended that help. [00:36:15] Joe: I love that idea. I’m gonna start asking you for money then, Jenny. [00:36:19] Jannese: You’re gonna have to marry into the family first. Joe. Damn [00:36:26] Joe: the place I want to go next because you know, you talk about budgeting, you talk about saving, you go through the gamut of financial topics from here. But a place that we don’t talk about enough, and a problem that a lot of people have is they don’t advocate for themself. They just don’t make enough money. [00:36:44] I can’t tell you the number of times when I was a financial planner, Janice, that people were doing great with the dollars, they were doing good with the budget. And I just said, listen, this is just an income problem. [00:36:54] Jannese: Yeah. [00:36:55] Joe: How do you begin this idea of advocating for yourself? [00:36:59] Jannese: Well, it’s scary, right? So I think it’s important. [00:37:02] It’s super scary for folks to acknowledge the emotions that come up with just the thoughts. And uh, in the book, I cite the statistic that like 60% of women never negotiate their salary, which is. Probably, you know, obviously on top of all the patriarchal systems in place that is not helping our cause. So I like telling people to start small. [00:37:22] I don’t want you to think like you read the book and then you’re gonna walk into work and negotiate a $75,000 raise on day one. You have to just get good at negotiating on a smaller level. So calling up your credit card company and telling them, Hey, I think my interest rate is too high. My credit score is like an 800. [00:37:40] Can we do something about this? Or calling up your cable company who has just sent you a notification that your rate is gonna go up by 25% and ask them. Can you guys keep this introductory offer that I signed up for? Because if not, I’m just gonna go to another provider. Right? Like, when you get comfortable just advocating for yourself on those small ways, it’s something that permeates the rest of your life. [00:38:00] And I even find too people that get, get good at that conversation of just like confronting something and asking for what they deserve. They also apply that to like relationships and just all different types of aspects of your life that will improve, uh, overall when you have the skillset. [00:38:17] Joe: Man, I am so bad at that. [00:38:19] Like, just, just, just, you know, I mean there’s a ton of cultural stuff in your book and just my Midwest, west Michigan, nice Dutch boy. Background is like, yeah, you don’t make those waves. You don’t ask for that. Why do you think you’re special, Joe? Why do you think you’re special? Why should you get it? And other people can’t get it? [00:38:40] Jannese: Well, I think at the end of the day, you have to realize you have to be your own best advocate, right? And so if you’re not able to speak up for yourself and be your own biggest cheerleader and be able to tell people like why it is that you deserve what you deserve, you cannot expect anyone else to do that work for you. [00:38:55] Joe: This is obviously really important at work, and you’ve got a method to use to talk yourself up for people that you know, they’re afraid they’re gonna drone on too long. We, we all know that person at work, right? Who walks in with their peacock feathers out every day and you’re like, oh God, not again. Well, hell, you and I, you and I, and our virtual work, we see this online. [00:39:13] I’m thinking of one creator that if I see one more self-promotional video about how freaking great they are, I’m gonna choke myself and them, and then I’ll be viral. It’ll be great. [00:39:23] Jannese: Yeah. [00:39:26] Joe: But you call this the STAR method and I kinda like this ’cause it’s very to the point, situation, task, action result. [00:39:33] Walk us through this. How does the STAR method of advocating for yourself at work? [00:39:37] Jannese: Okay, so STAR is a method that I actually learned at work, believe it or not, there are some useful things you can learn at work, and this was something that was discussed during the performance review process. You know, our managers would be like, just make sure like you’re giving actionable information when you’re asking for how you handled a situation. [00:39:56] So, uh, STAR stands for situation, task, action, and result. The first one is situation. So you’re setting the scene, making sure to only give the necessary details. I’ll give an example of what this looks like. Task is, you’re making it very clear exactly what your role or responsibility was in that situation. [00:40:15] Action. You’re explaining exactly what steps you took to address it, but you don’t need to give the A to Z, just the crucial steps and result, share what the outcomes were that you achieved. So let’s say for example, profits at your company. Were down one year. This is the situation and your manager asks you to look for a way to increase sales. [00:40:34] This is the task. You look around at your accounts and you look at how you can provide better service while maybe offering some like targeted discounts to bring in more business. That’s what you took as an action and your result is that you increased sales by 20%. When you’re advocating, especially for like a raise at work, you want to be very specific about how you personally have helped the company achieve some goal. [00:40:59] Usually a financial goal or some sort of metric that’s important to the company. And I found that time and time again when you get really good at. Telling those stories, it’s much easier to advocate for why you deserve a pay raise versus just saying, I work really hard guys, and I’m 60 hours a week and I’m always logged in and I answer the phone even on vacation. [00:41:20] Okay. That’s not the way to do it. [00:41:24] Joe: Even worse, my red just went up and I need more money. [00:41:26] Jannese: Right. No one cares [00:41:29] Joe: the number of people that’s still going with that. I’m like, your boss doesn’t care. Yeah. Your boss does not care. [00:41:33] Jannese: They really don’t. [00:41:34] Joe: But how many times have you heard, and you and I both from listeners, from viewers, that you know you have a bar night out with colleagues and you find out the person doing the same damn job you’re doing, or even a lesser job is being paid more money than you are, right? [00:41:50] Yeah. Yeah. You also talk about coupling this method with go find out what your worth is. [00:41:55] Jannese: Mm-Hmm. Yeah. I am a very shameless, like, what do you make? Ask her if you will, like, I, I’m just nosy. You know, I think part of that is why I’m a podcaster. I just wanna know about people’s lives, but gives you an excuse, you know, for me, I’m just like, if we can talk about our latest Tinder hookup, okay. [00:42:12] We can talk about how much money we make. All right? Maybe you gotta give folks a couple drinks before they feel comfortable with that conversation. But I promise you that information is gonna be life changing. And let’s say you don’t have people in your circle who are also in your career field. This is the power of LinkedIn and networking and going to in-person events. [00:42:32] Like you need to just expand your network so that you have the context of like, am I actually making the money that I should or am I not? And it’s also useful to use websites like um, glassdoor.com where you can get some insight into not only a position, but the region where you work, the company, all of that stuff can have a really big impact on if you’re actually getting paid what you deserve. [00:42:55] Joe: It’s so invaluable if you’re like, I’m at the low end of my pay range. And then you use the star method to talk about what you actually did to impact results. Hold what a one two punch. [00:43:04] Jannese: Well, and I think also it’s okay to leave your job too if you’re not getting what you need from a salary perspective. [00:43:12] One of the things that I was. Told as a kid was like, you don’t leave a job. Like once you’re there, you stay there. And I’ve had family members, me too, who’ve worked at the same place for 40, 50 years, and that’s where they retire from since the age of 18. That, for me is not the way to go. Loyalty does not pay for the most part, usually in, in the corporate environment. [00:43:32] And I’ve had. 10, 15, 20, 20 5% pay raises from job hopping. I’m not saying like every six months get a new job because then that kind of makes you look a little bit like a flight risk. But every two to three years, once you’ve gotten good at your job, and if you feel like you’re not growing and you don’t have that potential to earn more, it’s time to start putting out some fielders out there and figure out if there’s somewhere else to go. [00:43:55] Joe: I love the phrase the, the phrase flight risk. Yeah. In that, in that context, like, somebody’s gotta watch Janice because at break I think she’s Bolton. Like she’s out the [00:44:05] Jannese: door. Clearly. I just saw her working on her resume at lunch. She’s ready to go. She’s gone. [00:44:11] Joe: Did you notice she was packing her? She was brought a cardboard box with her to work today. [00:44:15] Oh [00:44:15] Jannese: my God. Joe, let me tell you this story real quick. ’cause this is completely like related to what we’re talking about right now. When I decided to take the leap into full-time entrepreneurship, I actually was outed. By a colleague who told my boss that this was my intention because it was something that I was talking about on social media. [00:44:32] I didn’t think anybody from work was like actually following me, but apparently they were. And so they went and told my boss that I was planning to quit my job because I made like an Instagram post about it. And I got called into a meeting and I asked like, are you actually quitting your job? ’cause somebody told me that, you know, they saw this on Instagram. [00:44:48] And at that moment I was not actually planning to quit. You know, that month I was planning on like finishing out the year. This was like April, and I was planning on being there till December. So in that moment I had a split second decision to make. I’m like, do I deny this or do I just say, okay universe, I see what you’re doing. [00:45:06] This is the sign. And so I actually said, yes, I am planning on quitting my job. Actually, right after this meeting, I’m going to hand in my resignation letter, and that was April 30th, 2021. My book is coming out three years to the day. Wow. That I resigned from work to do this personal finance thing full time. [00:45:30] Wow. Isn’t that wild? That is, that is [00:45:34] Joe: fabulous. But at the time you must be going, oh shit. [00:45:38] Jannese: Yeah, I mean this, [00:45:40] Joe: this is now it’s real. [00:45:41] Jannese: It’s real. And you know, I had a lot of things in place and I was absolutely ready to make the jump, but it was just me paying attention to the signs. Again, be careful what you wish for. [00:45:51] Manifestation is real. [00:45:54] Joe: Yeah. But also take your, I dunno, there’s a piece of that story I love because it’s Take your life seriously. [00:45:59] Jannese: Yeah. [00:45:59] Joe: When I changed over to financial media at 40 years old, like I wish I would’ve done it at 30. [00:46:05] bit: Mm. Like [00:46:05] Joe: I should have done this way sooner. Yeah. Like the fact that I didn’t stayed in financial planning, which I like, but didn’t love was a mistake. [00:46:13] I should have taken my life more seriously in this concept of time that I can’t get back. [00:46:17] Jannese: Yeah. [00:46:17] Joe: It’s so frustrating. I wanna get back to, by the way, money and other things to negotiate besides pay ’cause this is really cool stuff. But while we’re on this topic, I was wondering, you have a side discussion here about mentors. [00:46:33] It seems to be that you really advocate going out and finding mentors, finding people to help you. I’m wondering if you had had better mentorship at that job when you were an engineer. Would you still be an engineer today? [00:46:48] Jannese: Ooh, that’s tough. I don’t know. I feel like I’ve always been a rebel and I just don’t like people telling me what to do. [00:46:52] So I, I just don’t think I’m built for the environment of just, you know, fitting into this piece of the puzzle. But I have to say, there was a lot of moments where I did feel completely isolated. Being the only woman, usually the only woman of color, usually the youngest person in the room by at least like a decade. [00:47:08] I just felt like I was navigating so many different spaces on my own, you know, and, and that started even in college and getting a master’s. There’s been so many firsts that I’ve had to navigate on my own as a kid that like. It’s been good in a way because it makes me be very hyper independent and know that like I got my own back. [00:47:25] But I do think there are scenarios where I could have used that mentorship. And so as an entrepreneur I’ve been very intentional about having amazing mentors, especially because this arena is so wild. You know, there’s just so much information to learn. There’s a lot of stuff that you just don’t even know. [00:47:42] You know, how, how much do I charge for a speaking engagement? Or like, how do you find an agent to help you, you know, get your book deal. There’s so many questions and so when you can find people who can support you and who genuinely wanna pour into you and that you are willing to have a reciprocal relationship with two, because I think that’s an important part of mentorship. [00:48:00] It can’t just be you taking, taking, taking. There has to be, you know, that give and take. I think it’s really important. It’s really impactful. [00:48:07] Joe: Back to pay raises. You tell your readers, Hey, if you scored a raise using this awesome methodology, high five mm-hmm. But if you don’t, there’s still other things that you can look at and negotiate instead. [00:48:19] And I just wanna walk through these and if you can comment on these, that’s great. Health and wellness benefits, you can negotiate. [00:48:25] Jannese: Yeah, absolutely. So there are some companies who offer, like I had a discount if I joined like a gym, I could get mental health therapy at a discount. And so there are different programs that you could bring up to your HR department and literally be like, can you guys think about offering this? [00:48:41] Because y’all are stressing us out and we need therapy. So like let’s make that a benefit, you know? [00:48:47] Joe: Yeah, yeah. Retirement benefits. I know we’ve had stackers in our community that say, listen, I’d love to have some type of retirement plan when they didn’t have one. And the boss is like, oh, I never knew that was important to you. [00:48:57] And they did it. But time off is another one that I really like that I think more time off is a great replacement if the boss can’t give you more money. [00:49:05] Jannese: Yeah, I negotiated that with my last job. They were offering me two weeks, and I was coming from a position where I had three weeks of PTO. So I said, can you guys match this time off? [00:49:15] And it was not an issue. [00:49:17] Joe: Professional development, I think is another one. ’cause I, I don’t know in the boss’s eyes, Janice, that helps them and you. [00:49:23] Jannese: Yeah, absolutely. So signing up for things like personal development classes, coaching, going to events, I’ve done it all. I even got my master’s degree with tuition reimbursement so I didn’t have to pay the full price. [00:49:36] There are a lot of different perks that you can explore that don’t necessarily have to equal extra money in your paycheck, but it will save you money in different ways. [00:49:44] Joe: Guys, we just started talking about getting financially lit. You go through budgeting, saving, investing, debt management, mindful spending, getting educated, asking for help. [00:49:53] You know nothing. Mm-Hmm. Pretty much. Pretty much nothing and financially lit was available last Tuesday, which is amazing. Available everywhere. [00:50:02] Jannese: Yes, [00:50:03] Joe: financially lit book.com. We will link to it in the show notes. Janice, speaking of mentorship, thanks for mentoring our stackers today. I appreciate it. [00:50:09] Jannese: Thank you so much for having me. [00:50:11] bit: Hey, this is Jen Pilcher Navy spouse of 23 years, and when I’m not helping military spouses connect in our digital community, I’m Stacking Benjamins. [00:50:22] Joe: Huge thanks to Janice for joining us. Hey, time now for us to answer a call from a stacker who thought, you know what? I better call Saul. See hi IN og. This segment of the show is where people get to pick the brain of CF Pog on the show and find out, uh, well how we can answer your question. [00:50:42] If you’ve got a question for og, head to stacky Benjamins dot com slash voicemail, and today we get a question from, uh, stacker Jen. Hey, Jen. [00:50:52] Caller: Hi, Joe og and you too, Doug. My name is Jen. I’m a longtime listener, and I just finished the Stacked Book Club, which was awesome. I learned a lot, but more importantly, I got a lot done, even though I’m still working on some tasks. [00:51:05] Uh, while I was listening to one of your guest speakers podcast, they were talking about converting a regular IRA or rolling over, I should say, a regular IRA into an HSA. The limit for a single person in 2024 is $4,150, so would it make more sense for me to do it now when I’m 50 years old or to wait until I’m 55 years old and you can have an additional $1,000? [00:51:34] I’m thinking it’s better to do it now because the money I put in would grow more than a thousand dollars. Extra that I could put in. Um, but I was hoping to get your input on it. So if you get a chance, hopefully you can address my question. Hope you guys have a great day. Thanks so much for all that you do. [00:51:54] And I’ll just take a shirt that matches my awesome hazel eyes. Thanks. [00:51:59] Joe: Wow. Jen is awesome. We had so much fun doing the Stacked, uh, book with Jen and with a whole cohort of people that, uh, dove into their financial plans. Jen always had interesting questions, and this is an interesting one, og, uh, HSA from an IRA. [00:52:18] Let’s talk about the mechanics of that. [00:52:20] OG: IRA to to HSA. That’s, uh, that’s kind of fun, huh? Who wants to do that on a Monday morning, you know, in the first part of May. For SS and Gs. You [00:52:31] Joe: know what I do for fun? Yeah. Well if you’re Jen, here’s what you do. I [00:52:34] OG: do. IRA to HSA conversions. Yeah. This is one that doesn’t come up very often around IRA to HSA transfers trustee to trustee transfers, rollovers is what we use the term for. [00:52:46] And there’s a couple of rules here to remember. The first is, is that you have to still be eligible for an HSA for 12 months later. So if you do this, this conversion, let’s call it, or rollover in, you know, it’s the 1st of May and you wanna do this, you need to still be eligible for an HSA, which means you have to have a healthcare plan that’s eligible for an HSA 12 months from now. [00:53:07] So through the end of April of next year. So if you’re thinking about retiring, Hey, I’m gonna retire in a couple months, I can do this thing. That’s, you’re kind of nixed on that. Also, there’s some rules around Medicare funding and Medicare eligibility as you get closer to age 65. So 65 is when Medicare kicks in. [00:53:25] This really is be, it becomes pretty limited around. Age 64 because, uh, Medicare obviously is not an HSA plan and you’re covered by Medicare. So this window is basically until you turn 64. And what Jen’s talking about is, should I wait until I’m 55 where I can do an extra a thousand dollars? So, uh, the IRS allows you to do this, this HSA contribution, this rollover from an IRA to an HSA one time. [00:53:55] And what Jen’s talking about is if you wait till you’re 55, you get a little catch up, you can do an extra thousand. Should I wait a few years? And, you know, and then do the catch The question of course is, um, is the money gonna grow faster over the period of time, between now and when she’s 55 versus having the extra money in at age 55? [00:54:18] The way that I would think about this is the money already is in a tax deferred account, right? You’re in an IRA, you’ve already not paid taxes on it, and it’s sitting there and it’s invested in a manner. That you would long term. So let’s say it’s invested in an s and p fund, and your HSA would also be invested in HSA fund. [00:54:34] So that’s tomato. Tomato, right? And then, eh, eh, tomato. Tomato. There we go. Okay, good. Eh, there we go. Some people got it. Um, tomato. Tomato, yeah. Part on it’s tomato. Tomato. So that’s the same outcome in terms of tax deferral. The money’s invested. It’s in the same place. It’s gonna do the same thing over the next, you know, in Jen’s case, five years. [00:54:58] I don’t know why you wouldn’t wait until you’re 55 to do this. Now, here’s the other piece of this, this rollover is still subject to the maximum rules, maximum annual contribution of that year. So if she’s like, well, I’m already putting the 4,000 bucks in every year, [00:55:12] Joe: you’d have to stop that contribution to do that. [00:55:14] This isn’t [00:55:15] OG: a tool for you. Yeah, it’s, I mean, you’re just moving the money from one pocket to another. It’s like moving deck chairs around on the. Another yacht. So it’s the same money. He [00:55:23] Joe: was gonna say Titanic and then he realized I Oh, oh no, that’s bad. No, no, no. Not the analogy you’re looking for. This is not the analogy I was looking for. [00:55:30] OG: Well, was like, I mean, I was gonna say Titanic, but, but all I can think about when I say Dexter’s the Titanic as the movie where the guys are playing like the violin as they’re like sinking. It’s just such a great scene. They just keep playing, you know? So it has to be kinda a unique circumstance, right? [00:55:44] Like if you’re getting close to retirement and you’re maxing out all your savings, then you’re probably also maxing out your HSA savings this year. So why, you know, this would have to be a unique, like I don’t have the money this year. We had a one-time expense, but I have the money in my, I Rrn and I still want to do it, you know, and you get to do it one time. [00:56:03] So H 55 is a great time to, to do this one-time transfer, assuming that you still have the plan 12 months later. And also you’re not contributing out of pocket. So I would wait till 55. [00:56:15] Joe: Yeah, makes a ton of sense. But this is a little known rule, like you said, og, but I don’t think we’ve ever had this question before. [00:56:22] OG: I have never had it once. [00:56:24] Joe: Nice job, Jen, with that question. And you know what? We will send you a T-shirt and you can pick whichever one matches your eyes. Pick whichever one you want. Stacking Benjamins dot com slash voicemail is the way to be like Jen and to call the show with your question and we will get it in front of OG as fast as we can. [00:56:43] And by the way, if you’re not here to ask a question about HSAs and one time rollovers from IRAs, you’re here because you need a better plan overall. OG and his team are taking clients and head to Stacking Benjamins dot com slash og. If you want to go just right there to OGs calendar with his team to find out what it would take for his team to interface with you to make better money decisions going forward. [00:57:09] Alright, uh, we are gonna wander out to a segment that’s become more action packed lately. Doug, we got a lot going [00:57:17] Doug: on. Here on the back porch. I don’t know that we have enough time to talk about everything that’s going on, but recently you promised all of our listeners that you were gonna talk more about contributors coming to our round table. [00:57:27] So what news do you have for us there? [00:57:29] Joe: Yeah, we took the off week and we thought about it. Uh, for people that are new to this, uh, go back and listen to the show. Len Penso has decided after 14 years, you know what? The guy is in retirement and it’s time, it’s time to go celebrate retirement. Solen will be on from time to time, but he’s not going to be a frequent, uh, contributor. [00:57:45] Now here’s what we’re gonna do. Doug me. [00:57:47] Doug: Is it me? Are you gonna make [00:57:48] Joe: me a regular [00:57:49] Doug: round table [00:57:50] Joe: guy? We took the week and we decided we didn’t wanna show you up. So, you know, uh, mom’s gonna take over for a little bit and, uh, because mom can’t be bothered to come to the microphone. We’re gonna have different people on the microphone for a while. [00:58:02] And, uh, mom will be the contributor when it comes to the trivia question. So she’ll take over for Len there. And then we’re gonna have just a parade of interesting people. We’ve had so many Doug, so many interesting people. On the show. And, uh, we don’t wanna make this decision quickly. So yeah, it’s [00:58:18] Doug: kind of fun to have all that variety and hear all those different viewpoints. [00:58:22] Joe: Yeah. [00:58:22] Doug: So, so that’s where we’re at on that. So here’s what I want to know. So, if mom at the end of the year wins the trophy that gets filled up with like, Hershey’s kisses and cookies, and, and then she gets the cake, I can have some of that, right? Do I get it? I get some of that, right? Well, you gotta ask her. [00:58:40] You gotta ask her. She’s never gonna give me that. [00:58:43] Joe: I know. Well, uh, uh, ask her, [00:58:45] Doug: uh, [00:58:46] Joe: next [00:58:46] Doug: week, you’re hitting the road. [00:58:48] Joe: I am. And I’m hoping that, uh, OG comes with me. He says he doesn’t really want whatever I, you and I remember Doug, we told him about this months ago, that I would be in Cleveland on May 14th. [00:59:02] And by the way, go to Stacking Benjamins dot com slash meetup, Stacking Benjamins. Dot com slash meetup for a free ticket. And uh, we are going to be at Book House Brewing, which is the same place we went for my book tour. So Emily and I were there. Kevin Pay, yeah. What 7:00 [00:59:20] Doug: AM from they’re hosting you at 7:00 AM there [00:59:22] Joe: 6:30 PM Yes, because we wanna have a, a few microbrews, have some fun, and, uh, we’ve got a full agenda. [00:59:29] What we’re gonna do with these meetups is similar to what we do on the show. We’ll have a headline segment, which will be a current event. Uh, maybe the same one we talk about on the show, but you guys will be chatting about it with us. Then we’ll have a featured segment and we’ll also then have a back porch where we share some resources that, uh, everybody in the, in the group is using to get better off with, uh, money. [00:59:52] So it should be a great time. Six 30 on the 14th. Book House Brewing. Man, they got some good beers. Doug. You’d really like that beer. I bet they do. [01:00:01] Doug: I haven’t been to a brew house that didn’t have at least one beer. Is Doug going. Uh, don’t think I’m gonna make it to Cleveland, but I’m definitely going to Detroit two days later. [01:00:11] I’m [01:00:11] Joe: hoping that we’ll have, we might have, uh, crystal Hammond there. I’m hoping that we’ll have Kevin Payne from, uh, family Money Adventure. I also know, uh, podcasting icon. Dave Jackson lives in the area and hopefully Dave Jackson will join us. Should be fun. But to your point, two days later, Detroit still don’t have a home in Detroit. [01:00:32] Thought we had a home. Don’t have a home. Hopefully on Wednesday for sure, by the Friday show of this week, we will know where we’re at in Detroit on the 16th. Uh, we’re down to a final couple. I don’t wanna say what we’re even thinking of, but Detroit, same thing. Stack Benjamins dot com slash meetup and uh, you’ll, you’ll see. [01:00:53] Just keep refreshing and you’ll see when tickets become available there. Like they’re [01:00:57] Doug: trying to get Taylor Swift concert tickets. [01:00:59] Joe: Yes, and we’re still up for Kalamazoo. Obviously. A Friday night, a Friday night in a town on graduation weekend is proving to be difficult, but man, we’re hoping that Grand Rapids in Kalamazoo. [01:01:10] You guys can join us in Kalamazoo. The place that we went to for free, just to tell you what’s going on. We went to HopCat for free. Doug, you and I on the book tour. Yeah. We had this amazing back room. They want three grand for that same space. [01:01:24] Doug: Wow. Yeah. Yeah. Well, if you, if you bring me to the KSU one, I’ll probably drink enough to have them cover that nut. [01:01:34] Joe: We’re, we’re talking about doing what we’ve done in the past sometimes, which is just, we reserve a couple tables and then we go, oh, I’m sorry. We’ve got a few more people here. Oh, I’m sorry. We’ve got a few more people here and see, uh, see [01:01:44] Doug: what happens. Oh, why is that person standing up and talking? [01:01:47] OG: Yes, we do, [01:01:48] Joe: we do have a [01:01:49] Doug: couple great [01:01:49] Joe: leads. [01:01:50] Try to play [01:01:50] OG: your cards out like in advance, you know, that’s if the person’s listening, bro. Oh, I’m [01:01:55] Joe: sure. Yes. The Bobcat manager’s like, we’re onto you. You can’t do that. That’s horrible. Yeah. So hopefully, uh, by Friday show this week we have a spot, but stacky Benjamins dot com slash meetup and then in Boston, again finalizing our spot. [01:02:12] Boston also huge, huge expenses. Week later, Boston’s [01:02:17] Doug: currently slated for May 23rd, right? [01:02:20] Joe: Yeah, May 23rd. We’d be there to kick off, uh, Memorial Day weekend. Should be a great time. Thursday night, gonna hang out with some stackers Friday night, go into Fenway for the first time. Guys, never been to a game at Fenway Park. [01:02:32] Doug: It’s okay. Cool. It’s mid, [01:02:34] Joe: it’s in mid, yeah. Not as good as some of those new generic parks. Yeah. You know? Yeah. There’s not a lot of character fway. I wish they had some history, but that’s it there. And, and then, uh, Doug, what else we got? [01:02:47] Doug: Okay, well we got a joke off final coming up. We, yep, we’re [01:02:51] Joe: gonna be doing that on Wednesday. [01:02:53] People will [01:02:54] Doug: be voting on Wednesday. Finally, gonna finish joking off people. Like really? That’s [01:02:57] Joe: finally a thing. [01:02:59] Doug: Yes. We’ve been edging around it. I was gonna say, we’ve been edging this for like four months and now finally the most painful joke off of all time. The [01:03:08] Joe: sweet release of the finals should be great. [01:03:12] All right. On that bad one, everybody’s like, oh man. Coming up on Wednesday, we’re gonna dive into a headline that you don’t wanna miss. A recent CBS news piece. Disclose the new number Americans think they need for retirement. We’re gonna talk about how to calculate your retirement number. How much do you really need? [01:03:32] That is, uh, on the show on Wednesday. Gonna be a great time. I. Doug. I think that’s it, man. Except for this, what should we, uh, have on our to-do list for today? [01:03:43] Doug: Well, Joe, here’s what’s stacked up on our to-do list. First, take some advice from Janice Torres and get started. You can bring better money habits into your life. [01:03:53] What’s the next thing you need to do? Get rolling on it right now. Second, take some advice from our headline. Manage your 401k well and new SEC rules don’t matter. You can then take your advisor’s advice and reach financial security safely. What’s the biggest to do? I need to book a role in a series finale. [01:04:15] Why work the whole year when you can get way more views in just one episode? Someone’s gotta tell all these actors to work smarter, not harder. Thanks to Janice Torres for joining us today. You can find her new book Financially Lit, wherever books are sold. We’ll also include links in our show notes at Stacking Benjamins dot com. [01:04:36] This show is The Property of SB podcasts, LLC, copyright 2024, and is created by Joe Saul-Sehy. Our producer is Karen, Repine. Karen and Joe. Get help from a few of our neighborhood friends. You’ll find out about our awesome team at Stacking Benjamins dot com, along with the show notes and how you can find us on YouTube and all the usual social media spots. [01:04:59] Come say hello. Oh yeah, and before I go, not only should you not take advice from these nerds, don’t take advice from people you don’t know. This show is for entertainment purposes only. Before making any financial decisions, speak with a real financial advisor. I’m Joe’s Mom’s neighbor, Duggan. We’ll see you next time back here at the Stacking Benjamin Show.
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